Mormons

[The General]

Mormons believe the tithepayers among them will not be burned at the second coming (and I guess God will just fry the rest of their asses)...

Yeah, I remember, when I was a Mormon as a kid, my Bishop jokingly calling it 'fire insurance.' 
Way to scare the kids, guys.

[JustOneFix]

Yeah, I remember, when I was a Mormon as a kid, my Bishop jokingly calling it 'fire insurance.' 
Way to scare the kids, guys.

Interesting!

I know around here most people get fire insurance to cover their losses when Jewish Lightning strikes.

[b_dubb]

do i want to know what that means Just?

[MV/Liberace!]

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,100862,100862,quote=1

Care to respond, General?

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

[The General]

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,100862,100862,quote=1

Care to respond, General?

Sent from my DROIDX

I read that at the time, actually.  It's been 6 months.

But anyway, no, not really.  If you read Ana and I's volleys, especially on the first 2 pages, my responses  stand on their own merit.  I can sum up my whole point by saying this: Trying to discredit Mormonism by using sources that the Mormons themselves denounce is unnecessary when the texts and practices that they ACTUALLY DO FOLLOW and declare to be from God are batshit enough to use against them.  Citing apocryphal and unofficial Mormon sources only makes you look ill versed on the subject and discredits your entire argument.

I'm also being misquoted: I never said that the Doctrine and Covenants is not considered an official source, I said that the Journal of Discourses is not official, and therefore shouldn't be used to try to debunk Mormonism. 

What blows me away is this- Anagrammy and I are both ex-mormons that think Mormonism is a lie and a scam, and you would think that we could agree on the facts.  Apparently not.  Anyway, it became tedious trying to read 1000 word 'copy and pasted' posts.

[M Knight]

I find it fascinating how some people can be as religiously against something as they were religiously for something.  The fixation need remains the same. 

If, through inner growth and experience one needs to move beyond an entity affiliation such as a religious group, do yourself a psychological favor, move on, and leave the experience and entity far behind you.

Life is too short.

[anagrammy]

I find it fascinating how some people can be as religiously against something as they were religiously for something.  The fixation need remains the same. 

If, through inner growth and experience one needs to move beyond an entity affiliation such as a religious group, do yourself a psychological favor, move on, and leave the experience and entity far behind you.

Life is too short.

OR...you can give a shit about the wonderful people still trapped inside a cult.  I do a lot of counseling with people leaving Mormonism, helping them discover critical thinking and the joys of deciding for yourself what you eat and drink.  Dealing with the shunning by the the Mormon Church when you leave and even shunning by family members can be extremely painful.  Speaking of pain, gay members and missionaries suffer terribly.

One example from this week was a missionary who took a survey while he was in the MTC (Missionary Training Center).  At the end of the survey, it asked if he would make comments on the multiple choice questions (which was of basic Mormon doctrine), were they clear, etc.  He provided detailed feedback on how some of them were actually confusing and made suggestions for improvement.  A few days later he was brought up on charges of "speaking ill against the Lord's annointed" which is the Orwellian speech-control rule that all Mormons have to obey.  They are excommunicated if they speak publicly, fired if they are a professor at the church school, and expelled if they are a student at BYU or Ricks.   

It's a choice, really.  People visit Africa and see the starving children, the filthy water, the birth defects.  Some come home and plan their next trip.  Some "next trips" are to adopt one of the orphans, bring money and people to build a well, or bring fellow doctors to operate on cleft palates for free.  Other "next trips" are to a place on the other side of the world with white sands and a luxury spa.


Anagrammy

[DanDan]

Oh hey, I'm a Mormon. But fuck do I swear too much.

It's a nice church with (mostly) good intentions. I plan to go on a mission in three years, but will I have to lie about the intrusive questions asked in the interview? Yes. Do I agree with all the proclamations the prophets have given? No. But it works for me. I'm a full tithe-payer, was Deacon's and Teacher's quorum president, and soon to be Eagle Scout; your average Mormon youth. Even if Mormonism isn't truefuckyeahblue, it's an okay life to live -- for me, at least.

Now someone make a polygamy joke.

[anagrammy]

When you get a little older, having to lie makes a difference.  Like having to not tell people the whole truth about Mormon theology when you are a missionary.  Like realizing you are taking perfectly happy people and teaching them to fear that they will not be "with" their families in eternity unless they pay your church 10% of their income.  And then sticking your hand out for one bean out of the ten that they have for dinner.

Don't miss Raptor Jesus' book coming out this year about his life and mission.  You should read some of his posts on www.exmormon.org.  He has invented a whole higher level of swearing "ha fucking ha" and you two would totally hit it off.  Wait til you read about the guys who have to get a doctor's prescription to masturbate. HooooWEEEE!  No, not a cult.

Just wait til you have to lie to your own children. Believe me, personal integrity matters.

Anagrammy

[The General]

Oh hey, I'm a Mormon. But fuck do I swear too much.

It's a nice church with (mostly) good intentions. I plan to go on a mission in three years, but will I have to lie about the intrusive questions asked in the interview? Yes. Do I agree with all the proclamations the prophets have given? No. But it works for me. I'm a full tithe-payer, was Deacon's and Teacher's quorum president, and soon to be Eagle Scout; your average Mormon youth. Even if Mormonism isn't truefuckyeahblue, it's an okay life to live -- for me, at least.

Now someone make a polygamy joke.

No polygamy joke, but you're kidding, right?
The things you claim would make you a male.

[anagrammy]

Good catch, General.

A lot of underappreciated Mormon women get off on posing as a fuckety-fuck-fuck male.

Anagrammy

[Art]

So, uh, what do you Mormons eat?

[The General]

So, uh, what do you Mormons eat?

Crickets and honey. 

[Morgus]

is there truth to the reports of them wearing "magic" undergarments?
Howard Stern has asked about that on his show.

[anagrammy]

is there truth to the reports of them wearing "magic" undergarments?
Howard Stern has asked about that on his show.

Absolutely true.  Only after Mormons have qualified to go to the Temple (don't masturbate, pay 10% and PAY UP IF YOU ARE BEHIND, don't drink/smoke/coffee, attend 3 hour church meeting, work free for the church, are faithful or celibate, and don't speak out against the Mormon church) 

The magic underwear is called "garments" and they carry buttonholes over the nipples, navel and one knee.  These are symbols representing the same things Masons believe in.  Masons actually used to cut these symbols through the fabric into the flesh, leaving scars for reminders of oaths.  Joseph Smith "imported" the Masonic temple ceremony for the purpose of making the ladies he was poking swear they wouldn't tell or they would allow themselves to be killed.  Emma, Joseph's wife, objected to having her chest carved and designed the garments with symbolic red thread to represent the blood of the cuts.  The red became white overtime and the long union suit evolved with changing fashion to be the hideous creations they are today - tops and bottoms of nylon or cotton, like boxers and t shirts.  They insure modesty because they must be covered at all times.

At first they had no super powers, but then as a matter of Mormon folklore, like every religion has, there began to circulate rumors that the garment had saved so-and-so from getting burned because the flames stopped where his garments started.  OR, my personal favorite, the body found floating in the ocean had been eaten by sharks, except where the garments were.  Today even the average Mormon can give you a garment urban legend off the top of his head.  The general authorities of the church tell them as inspirational stories from the pulpit. 

Taking advanced courses in Utah in Folklore of Religion at Utah State, I learned additional super powers that were believed by some members:  that if you had sex without taking off the sacred underwear, your child would be more spiritual, maybe even a prophet.  OR, Joseph Smith was killed because he was not wearing his garments the day he was shot--they would have stopped the bullets.

I personally dated a man in Utah, a high school principal, and took him with my family on a rockhunting camping trip.  After refusing to help put up the tent, he refused to take off his garments to bathe or change them the whole four days.  He ended up having the tent to himself and the kids and I slept outside.  My teenagers were in hysterics laughing at this superstitious nonsense, which he explained, "There are wild animals out there and for all we know, my garments are protecting us all."

Anagrammy

[lasertron]

The more I learn about Mormonism, honestly, the more weirded-out and concerned I feel for my LDS friends.

[anagrammy]

I read that at the time, actually.  It's been 6 months.

But anyway, no, not really.  If you read Ana and I's volleys, especially on the first 2 pages, my responses  stand on their own merit.  I can sum up my whole point by saying this: Trying to discredit Mormonism by using sources that the Mormons themselves denounce is unnecessary when the texts and practices that they ACTUALLY DO FOLLOW and declare to be from God are batshit enough to use against them.  Citing apocryphal and unofficial Mormon sources only makes you look ill versed on the subject and discredits your entire argument.

I'm also being misquoted: I never said that the Doctrine and Covenants is not considered an official source, I said that the Journal of Discourses is not official, and therefore shouldn't be used to try to debunk Mormonism. 

What blows me away is this- Anagrammy and I are both ex-mormons that think Mormonism is a lie and a scam, and you would think that we could agree on the facts.  Apparently not.  Anyway, it became tedious trying to read 1000 word 'copy and pasted' posts.

General, I consider you a friend and we resolved our differences long ago.  Don't know why Mike brought this up now- it's an oldie and I don't hold the same view now as I did then.  I'm actually going to be in Utah in October and would love to get together for a drink.  Here at the religion of George Noory Sucks, there are many denominations but we all believe in one savior, Art Bell.  I await his (Fourth?) Coming...

Anagrammy

[The General]

General, I consider you a friend and we resolved our differences long ago.  Don't know why Mike brought this up now- it's an oldie and I don't hold the same view now as I did then.  I'm actually going to be in Utah in October and would love to get together for a drink.  Here at the religion of George Noory Sucks, there are many denominations but we all believe in one savior, Art Bell.  I await his (Fourth?) Coming...

Anagrammy

Oh, don't think that I harbor any ill feelings, I don't.  And I know you don't either.  I've always enjoyed going back and forth with people on this forum, and I really like that nobody ever takes it to a personal level... well for the most part.  But, yeah, if I were in Utah, sure, we'd have a drink. 

[MV/Liberace!]

Don't know why Mike brought this up now- it's an oldie and I don't hold the same view now as I did then.

I stumbled across it while googling the term "CoastGab.com" and felt it was obviously relevant to a conversation taking place here.

Sent from my Droid X.

[Harmness]

Aaaaahhh!  You shitstirrer!

[MV/Liberace!]

Aaaaahhh!  You shitstirrer!

who, me?

[anagrammy]

Mormon muscle on display as young reporter airs some Mormon beliefs on national news.  He did get one thing wrong, though.  It was Joseph Smith, the founder of Mormonism, who said the Garden of Eden was in Missouri and that Mormons would return in the last days and build a temple in Independence.

Let's hope the religious mafia doesn't whack this guy's career:

http://linkstomemphis.com/2011/07/fox-13-ben-ferguson-take-heat-for-segment-on-romney-mormons.html

Pull out the theater chairs, folks, the spotlight is swinging to illuminate Mormonism since we have two wearers of magic protective underwear running for President!  At least we can save some money on Secret Service agents....


Anagrammy

[BobGrau]

Given the recent display of can-do attitude presented by our resident Young Mormon dandan, I'm beginning to wonder if there's something to this old-timey religion stuff after all.

...then again, he pretends to be a girl so chances are he's pretending about being a mormon as well.

CONCLUSION: you can't trust religious people, even when they might not really be religious. 

[anagrammy]

Given the recent display of can-do attitude presented by our resident Young Mormon dandan, I'm beginning to wonder if there's something to this old-timey religion stuff after all.

...then again, he pretends to be a girl so chances are he's pretending about being a mormon as well.

CONCLUSION: you can't trust religious people, even when they might not really be religious. 

You have to have cantaloupe balls to ignore the threats of Mormon authorities and fuckety-fuck-fuck swear, drink/eat what you want, lie during worthiness interviews, masturbate when you feel like it,  pretend to be the other sex, my hat is off to him.

I can't imagine a better suited candidate for calling Coast with a different name and story every time!

Anagrammy

[DanDan]

Aww, don't make me blush. :3

You're probably familiar with it, Ana, but I think I'm becoming one of those New Order Mormons (read: likes the church but doesn't adhere to all the standards).

[anagrammy]

Aww, don't make me blush. :3

You're probably familiar with it, Ana, but I think I'm becoming one of those New Order Mormons (read: likes the church but doesn't adhere to all the standards).

I am very familiar with NOMs.  Usually they want to work "from within" to affect changes.  They believe what they want and don't believe what the want, so critical thinking is employed in making those choices.

I have a question for you-- what is the difference between NOM and the new breed of Cafeteria Mormons, if you know?

Anagrammy

[DanDan]

I have a question for you-- what is the difference between NOM and the new breed of Cafeteria Mormons, if you know?

I hadn't heard of the term before you said it, but from from what I read (one blog post), it would seem NOMs see some aspects of the church as wrong or unnecessary, hence not abiding to those standards. Cafeteria Mormons seem like strong believers who feel everything about the church is correct, but choose not to do them, probably out of laziness.

[anagrammy]

One can't assume the definitions are the same, but when I was Catholic, Cafeteria Catholic was a derogatory term meaning someone who would pick and choose what to believe, i.e, yes on Virgin Birth, no on obeying Pope on birth control, yes on obeying Pope on covered heads in church, etc.

The Cafeteria Catholic was diligent in observing what he or she believed in.

Anagrammy

[Theodoric]

One can't assume the definitions are the same, but when I was Catholic, Cafeteria Catholic was a derogatory term meaning someone who would pick and choose what to believe, i.e, yes on Virgin Birth, no on obeying Pope on birth control, yes on obeying Pope on covered heads in church, etc.

The Cafeteria Catholic was diligent in observing what he or she believed in.

Anagrammy

I have always heard this expression as "salad bar" whatever. Politics, religion or any ideology where one picks and chooses. Both seem like pretty fitting expressions. But I feel in general with institutions and dogma people will always have to rebel (if not externally than internally) because without irrefutable proof the mind always considers alternative possibilities. I guess that is where the word "faith" comes in but then again faith in humans is usually a tool of manipulation. Ugg carry on just wanted to contribute to the conversation.

[anagrammy]

WARREN JEFFS, Prophet of the Original Mormon Church, found guilty.

Some people don't realize that polygamy is still a commandment in Mormonism.  They still believe in it; it is still a requirement to get to the highest degree of heaven (godhood), and can be found in Doctrine and Covenants Section 132, a Mormon scripture.  So when Mormons say they are against polygamy, that's not entirely correct.  It is a requirement for their religion and they don't practice it because it would have cost Utah statehood.

Warren Jeff's fundamental group are actually the true followers of Joseph Smith, believing his revelations and copying his behavior.  The popular Mormon church is an apostate offshoot which followed Brigham Young to Utah and became the most successful Mormon denomination.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44021900/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

Anagrammy