Archiving midnight in the desert

[ziznak]

Morgus always makes so much sense. Despite this, I like him.

no shit... where do i sign up keith???

[Morgus]

no shit... where do i sign up keith???

Perhaps Keith could even get free volunteers to do some of the work to help Art?
Some perhaps have technical expertise to farm out some of the work to donate their time rather than cash.

[dan7800]

Give Art/Keith time and just let things settle in. Anyone who has ran a significant operation/software release before would know that the first few weeks are very stressful and I am sure Keith has enough on his plate and doesn't need any assistants.

Read "The Mythical Man Month" and the adding of resources problem.

[Morgus]

Keith does need at least an assistant to take care of the network when he sleeps or takes a vacation in the future.
But I think other side tasks could use an intern or assistant so the website and archives stay more up to the date quickly.
With Art Bell now back on 5 nights/week plus Hoagland, its more than a one-man job now!

[Keyser Söze]

I still enjoy Art, just not going to pay for it until they figure out what they are excatly what they are going to do for paying subbers.

Take a deep breath, take a long walk, relax, maybe take a nap and give them a chance to get everything worked out.

I could understand everyone's concerns if the show had been on for 6 months with no resolutions, but hey, it's only been three days and one of those shows was a test.

Everyone chill out, this is an indie show, not a ginormous corporate show with dozens of minions, that's why its Special.

[boilingpitsofsewage]

How do you record the live stream onto your computer?

Well that can be a long complicated process for someone who hasn't done it before.. but I would suggest check google. 
Anyone can record, but to record a high-quality crystal-clear mp3 it takes some basic knowledge and know how.

I just say anyone who records their own shows like I do, music and all, can always just donate $5 a month, and everyone is happy. 

[paladin1991]

I have emailed Keith re. the dysfunctional archives and so far no joy.  This is old tech.-if this does not get fixed, Art needs to get a new webmaster-This archive situation is going to cost Art subscribers and ultimately the show. I am giving it 2 more days then I will bail.

For those that do not know I am referring to the pause/play and download not working.  Also the old tech. 3 segment instead of one.

Flood them w/ emails--Art I hope you are reading this.

Such a disappointment!!!!

https://youtu.be/yhQql-ZbZmg?t=7s

[nooryisawesome]

I have emailed Keith re. the dysfunctional archives and so far no joy.  This is old tech.-if this does not get fixed, Art needs to get a new webmaster-This archive situation is going to cost Art subscribers and ultimately the show. I am giving it 2 more days then I will bail.

For those that do not know I am referring to the pause/play and download not working.  Also the old tech. 3 segment instead of one.

Flood them w/ emails--Art I hope you are reading this.

Such a disappointment!!!!

It has even been a WEEK. Chill out. It is going to take some time. I have not had any problems with downloading the show archives.  $5 isn't much to support Art. Bailing after less than a week is pathetic.

[Asadora]

Well for all we know, Art may very well walking away from all of this by the end of 6 weeks - that is what happened last time right?

Art stopped working with Sirrus based on his principle.
I have a right to my own principle.

But having three segments to download one show, that is very old skool.
It's 2015 not 1996.

[twiki]

Well for all we know, Art may very well walking away from all of this by the end of 6 weeks - that is what happened last time right?

Art stopped working with Sirrus based on his principle.
I have a right to my own principle.

But having three segments to download one show, that is very old skool.
It's 2015 not 1996.

I think you have one too few of the letter s in your name.

Ask for a refund and fuck off.

[sydtron]

Hey guys.  I was just on facebook and helped a person become a time traveler.  Join as many ART FB groups as you can and help out.  If you see a post where they ask about downloading a show. Just tell them how to become a time traveler and then remember to put.  "Www.darkmatterdigitalnetwork.com"  in the post so that it will take them right to it.   Gotta catch the strays!! Lol. Every little bit helps. 

[Herakles]

Well for all we know, Art may very well walking away from all of this by the end of 6 weeks - that is what happened last time right?

Art stopped working with Sirrus based on his principle.
I have a right to my own principle.

But having three segments to download one show, that is very old skool.
It's 2015 not 1996.

I can understand the frustration with the archiving - but not surprised that there are some issues, considering the different browsers out there and devices to access the content. It has only been a week, I am sure any issues will be addressed, including the possibility of having one large file rather than being available just hourly. It just needs some patience and Keith to work his magic.

Even if you are having issues, I would look at it as supporting Art and this new venture. We have waited years for Art to be back on the air, this is not a time to withdraw support! so just go with it for a few months, look at it as making a donation to the new venture!  The ride will be great!

[LadyFish]

Well for all we know, Art may very well walking away from all of this by the end of 6 weeks - that is what happened last time right?

Art stopped working with Sirrus based on his principle.
I have a right to my own principle.

But having three segments to download one show, that is very old skool.
It's 2015 not 1996.

I thought you posted that you already quit being a Time Traveler, got your $5 refund, and that your husband was going to teach you to record the shows. Why are you still complaing?

And speaking of Art quitting, at least at Sirius, Art gave them six weeks to get their shit together. He didn't give them 3 days and quit, like you have done with Art.

[henge0stone]

Well for all we know, Art may very well walking away from all of this by the end of 6 weeks - that is what happened last time right?

Art stopped working with Sirrus based on his principle.
I have a right to my own principle.

But having three segments to download one show, that is very old skool.
It's 2015 not 1996.

You have every right to do what you want with your money but don't expect people to agree with someone who gave Art 3 days, was mad that commercial content wasn't in the archives then decided to record the show for his personal archives for free instead of paying the small subscription fee. This is an art bell form so we aint gonna take kindly to that.

[PING]

All in or nothing - I'm sure Art would understand, right? It's the principle of the thing for me and Keith's customer service was appalling. I don't want to pay for a service where the customer service is poor.

That's just me.

Yes honey, it IS you. EVERYTHING is all about you. 3 days into a groundbreaking new venture and you go from walking on water in giddiness to throwing a temper tantrum and quitting in 72 hours, and taking shots at Art to boot?

Such bad customer service that you got your $5 back after 3 days? I wish I always got such bad customer service. People may club Keith, but he is running Art AND Richard live, that's 6 hours a day, plus putting the Time Traveler archive together, plus doing God knows what else for show prep. Count yourself lucky you got a reply at all

Keith's right. if someone downloads a show from several weeks back, the news isn't news anymore, it's stale, even if it is paranormal news.

If I give you $5/month, will you please do a laserjock and leave, never ever to return? The fighting 5 people until they're butthurt is optional

[saucerlike]

Joining mp3 files is no more difficult than navigating the web.  Anyway you can't do anything about the music, 'tis a copyright issue.  I'm gonna be recording daily for my own personal archive, I paid my $5 to be a time traveler. 

[Juan]

Complete show with LMH, all commercials, music and the newscasts at 44.1/16-bit wav leaves a 1.74gig file.  But it sounds wonderful.  For my own use only, of course.

[jazmunda]

Complete show with LMH, all commercials, music and the newscasts at 44.1/16-bit wav leaves a 1.74gig file.  But it sounds wonderful.  For my own use only, of course.

[Wintermute]

Recording or copying work for personal use is allowed and covered under the Fair Use Act by RIAA. The re-broadcast or otherwise dissemination of that IP is the only illegal part. Downloading it and possessing it isn't even illegal.

It's like going to a museum and taking a picture of a great work of art. Then having a print made from your photo you took and hanging it somewhere in your house. That is perfectly legal. Now if you sold that same print without being licensed to do so, then your sale is deemed not "fair use" and illegal. However if you did make a sale to another individual, that individual does not have to give up the asset nor can be prosecuted for any crime. Their acquired media is covered under "fair use" until such time that it is publicly displayed or distributed.

People have been recording songs off the radio since there was consumer recording equipment. People have been distributing bootlegs for almost as long. If you are in the arts / entertainment / media business, bootlegs are and have been part of the culture since forever. Heck, they were considered part of "viral marketing" before the Internet. As long as it's not egregious, almost everyone looks the other direction. Heck, I have bootlegs of Bob and Tom from the 1990's that I got off of Napster! Did they ever even consider sueing anyone? NO. Only Metallica and Ice Cube ever bothered in the history of modern media. and you have to admit, Napster was "egregious". What was the fallout for those two "artists"? One does B-movies, the other group hasn't had a hit in 25 years. Suing your fans simply does not turn out well.

Back to Art Bell recordings...
1. They are already distributing MiTD online... multiple places to download it.

2. If Art Bell was so against it, he should have been p!!sed about those Google Drives and Torrents people posted here with old C2C / DM SXM broadcasts. Odds are he didn't care because he's already been paid and loved to grind an axe.

3. If Art's "Time Traveller" service sucks, and it costs $5, why wouldn't people want another option? Sucky services are what drive people to alternatives. Why do you think everyone wants to hear Art Bell? Because Snoory / C2C sucks!

[AZZERAE]

Recording or copying work for personal use is allowed and covered under the Fair Use Act by RIAA. The re-broadcast or otherwise dissemination of that IP is the only illegal part. Downloading it and possessing it isn't even illegal.

It's like going to a museum and taking a picture of a great work of art. Then having a print made from your photo you took and hanging it somewhere in your house. That is perfectly legal. Now if you sold that same print without being licensed to do so, then your sale is deemed not "fair use" and illegal. However if you did make a sale to another individual, that individual does not have to give up the asset nor can be prosecuted for any crime. Their acquired media is covered under "fair use" until such time that it is publicly displayed or distributed.

People have been recording songs off the radio since there was consumer recording equipment. People have been distributing bootlegs for almost as long. If you are in the arts / entertainment / media business, bootlegs are and have been part of the culture since forever. Heck, they were considered part of "viral marketing" before the Internet. As long as it's not egregious, almost everyone looks the other direction. Heck, I have bootlegs of Bob and Tom from the 1990's that I got off of Napster! Did they ever even consider sueing anyone? NO. Only Metallica and Ice Cube ever bothered in the history of modern media. and you have to admit, Napster was "egregious". What was the fallout for those two "artists"? One does B-movies, the other group hasn't had a hit in 25 years. Suing your fans simply does not turn out well.

Back to Art Bell recordings...
1. They are already distributing MiTD online... multiple places to download it.

2. If Art Bell was so against it, he should have been p!!sed about those Google Drives and Torrents people posted here with old C2C / DM SXM broadcasts. Odds are he didn't care because he's already been paid and loved to grind an axe.

3. If Art's "Time Traveller" service sucks, and it costs $5, why wouldn't people want another option? Sucky services are what drive people to alternatives. Why do you think everyone wants to hear Art Bell? Because Snoory / C2C sucks!

Thank you.

[SredniVashtar]

3. If Art's "Time Traveller" service sucks, and it costs $5, why wouldn't people want another option? Sucky services are what drive people to alternatives. Why do you think everyone wants to hear Art Bell? Because Snoory / C2C sucks!

That's not a good comparison. If people don't like the service (which is fair enough, if that is how they feel) then they should go and find another host that provides what they want and get it from them, not simply pilfer it from a torrent site. Art coming back is something that most people here have wanted for a long time and bitching after a couple of days is beyond shitty. This is not like something on the radio in the old days, this is something that needs direct support if it is to flourish. And the support that is being asked is as reasonable as anyone could expect.

I have had problems myself, but I just waited it out for a while, and things seem to be improving. It's frustrating but I trust that they will get sorted, for the simple reason that Art wouldn't stand for something being poor and would bust Keith's ass to get it fixed.

[Wintermute]

It's a perfect comparison... I am comparing host to host and service to service. Unlike you, I am not chaining host - to - service because they are separate. How? When a person says something through a public channel, it is now in public domain. That person has lost control over their content. Public domain has an inherent right to use. Ergo, the person is now no longer the owner of said content and commentary even if they try to make a "service" out of whatever they are doing. The service is what's called a "monetary control system". It is an artificial control-set designed as a for-profit service, after the fact.

I can like Art (and do, MiTD is excellent thus far). And I can like getting downloads in a timely manner. These are mutually exclusive. If the Time Traveler's service is a poor value proposition, regardless of download rate or issues, then alternatives will be sought. No one has the right to dictate personal value on a product or service... it's called the right to a personal opinion.

Then we are down to the bone: the value proposition. Is 20 mp3s and a "wormhole" to Art worth your $5/mo? That's on you. I'm not trying to sell you on anything. And notice no one has asked me if ** I ** am a Time Traveller. Maybe I am?

What I am saying: don't d@mn people because they don't see the value in being a Time Traveller. Heck I could argue that the value was never really fleshed out by Art. If Art was a little more forward thinking, he would re-broadcast the show from 1pm-4pm EST. That would cut down on the #1 reason people download the show... to listen to it during work b/c they aren't staying up past 1am. During the day, Dark Matter Radio has plenty of time slots, so the cost would be minimal. The sunk cost in the servers and bandwidth is already there. They could probably sell more ads anyway.

That's not a good comparison. If people don't like the service (which is fair enough, if that is how they feel) then they should go and find another host that provides what they want and get it from them, not simply pilfer it from a torrent site. Art coming back is something that most people here have wanted for a long time and bitching after a couple of days is beyond shitty. This is not like something on the radio in the old days, this is something that needs direct support if it is to flourish. And the support that is being asked is as reasonable as anyone could expect.

I have had problems myself, but I just waited it out for a while, and things seem to be improving. It's frustrating but I trust that they will get sorted, for the simple reason that Art wouldn't stand for something being poor and would bust Keith's ass to get it fixed.

[Echo]

My kind of archive would be with the following removed from the recording.
DarkMatter News
Fast forwarding tape sound between breaks
"Call Art" announcement
No bumper music

Just the show with the least amount of interruptions.


If Art manages to make it to 6 month mark, i might pay for a month to make my own archive of the past 6 months of shows.  That would take some time to edit each mp3 to remove all the stuff i mentioned above.

[smitty9999]

For people who are using Chrome and want to save the files, right click the file, choose save as.  Nothing will happen UNTIL you reload the page.  Once the page is reloaded, the save file dialog pops up and then you can save it locally

[devoidzero]

Complete show with LMH, all commercials, music and the newscasts at 44.1/16-bit wav leaves a 1.74gig file.  But it sounds wonderful.  For my own use only, of course.

It's also overkill and a huge waste of space.  DMDN only broadcasts at 48 kbps with a sample rate of 22 khz.  Recording at a higher bitrate/sample rate than the source simply inflates the file size, it can't add fidelity that isn't there in the source signal.

If you're going to record, the most sensible thing to do is use a program like streamWriter that captures the audio stream bit for bit.  It comes out to about 64 megabytes per show (including commercials and paranormal news).  That's the highest quality it's possible to get from the stream, and it's like 16 times smaller than your file.

[AZZERAE]

You can't stop anybody recording the show. So stop being such a bunch of babies, those of you bitching about piracy. Its not piracy. And being a Time Traveler alone doesn't capture the essence of the  show. Thats enough to press record.

[Ghostbuster]

Archiving the show is not a crime.
its if you where to post it publicly.
copyright law even allows you to make a copy for a friend.

[AZZERAE]

Archiving the show is not a crime.
its if you where to post it publicly.
copyright law even allows you to make a copy for a friend.

But do U.S. copyright laws apply to those outside the U.S., as it is a U.S. show is the question

[henge0stone]

After I cancelled my Time Traveler subscription yesterday upon realising that the paranormal news isn't included in the playback - I was sent a refund of my $5 back.
Though, it still doesn't make it fair for the people that pay don't get all the show, whereas the people that don't pay do.

I'll have to hope someone swashbuckles the program so I could -then- listen to the paranormal news. I would glady pay to hear the paranormal news as well, but as Keith said, 'it's a waste of time and space'. So I don't see the paranormal news being included in the playback anytime soon.

So, at least I got a refund of which I wasn't expecting, that's a positive from this.

Guess what, Dark Matter news is now on the podcasts, Art listened to the feedback and now its there. All you have to do was wait and give him a chance but no three days was just too long for you.

[Ghostbuster]

But do U.S. copyright laws apply to those outside the U.S., as it is a U.S. show is the question

the copyright laws are what laws are in place from where the source material is based...