Carbon dioxide levels highest for 800,000 years.

[West of the Rockies]

Look, I am an avowed liberal, and I DO recognize a weird cognitive dissonance when someone who claims to be progressive and all about tolerance and acceptance uses gay slurs and such.  I have said as much before here and probably annoyed a couple people in my camp for doing so.  I am personally dismayed by suggestions that a certain regular here is a pedophile.  I must have missed whatever event happened that led to this recurring theme.  I don't think such discourse benefits anyone.

But this is a free speech issue and I don't HAVE to like it.  I can put on my big boy pants and deal.

But you make a great point, DPS, that conservatives want to play hard-hitting tackle football, but their opponents can't tackle back.  It's flag football when they are on offense; it's tackle football when they're on defense. 

And I see mammoth horseshit spewing from the collective pie holes of people on the right as well.  I also see civility and humility, but that is not the norm on these threads.

We have much in common I suspect but are so riled up by partisan discord that we can't see it.

So it goes....

[Robert Ghostwolf's Ghost]

First we have one Lib making gay-baiting posts, now we have another unfavorably comparing Moslems to the Tea Party and to Christians.  I almost expect one of them to start calling us n***ers.

Geez, you have one heck of a persecution complex.  And I like how you assume you know my politics based on a few BellGab posts.  Just for future reference, I'm a left-leaning moderate civil libertarian.  That means that among other things, I don't care what sex acts you perform privately with consenting adults or inanimate objects; what, if anything, you worship; what you consume to get high; or how many guns you own as long as you're not harming anybody else by doing any of it.  I admit I gave liberalism a test drive back in the seventies, and decided not to buy in when I found the far left to be every bit as intolerant of deviation from their gospel as the far right.  Basically, I don't care for extremists of any ilk.

That said, I was comparing the Tea Party to the Taliban, who are not representative of the vast majority of Muslims.  In fact, the Taliban and their al-Qaeda buddies have killed and oppressed way more Muslims than Christians or members of any other religion.  In fact, the reason bin Laden wound up in Afghanistan is because he was kicked out of several other Muslim countries that refused to put up with his shit.  You can look it up.

As to the comparison, how else would you describe a political movement that wants to take this country back to the days when only white property owners were allowed to vote, and slavery was not only accepted, but the idea that slaves were sub-human was formally acknowledged by the Constitution for purposes of apportioning representation in Congress? 

[NowhereInTime]

Personally I think name calling is stupid anyways. I'd much rather focus on the failed policies of the other side. It's much more fun that way.

Personally, I find the avarice, misanthropy, misogyny, racism, sanctimony, and chicken-hawking tantrums of the Tea Baggers to be offensive.  Hence, they are the moral equivalent of dipping unwashed, hairy, sweaty, nasty testes into your mouth.
It's on them if they subsume it as an exclusive function of homosexuality and immediate overcompensate for (and overreact to) the label.

[NowhereInTime]

Wait, I thought the Moslems were another of the Lib's mascot groups.  "Unfairly singled out for the actions of the very few", we're instructed that "referring to them negatively only serves to perpetuate the stereotype".  And isn't 'faaair', sniffle.

First we have one Lib making gay-baiting posts, now we have another unfavorably comparing Moslems to the Tea Party and to Christians.  I almost expect one of them to start calling us n***ers.

Tired old Paper*Boy using his tired old canard.

First, the futile attempt to turn the tables (I'm surprised he hasn't dragged out "reverse racism" except that it such a pathetic defense) and seize the moral high ground with a grandstanding "j'accuse!" moment.

Then he uses that moment as an excuse to further push the racial argument based an his claim of liberal hypocrisy.

Except anyone who reads any conservative who has ever tried this knows there is a huge difference of the chronic, institutional racism of conservatism and the promotion of racial and gender equality of liberalism. 

Calling liberals racist rings hollow; it sounds like the pining for the good old days when you could drop slurs into conversation without some reprobation or rebuke.

[PB the Deplorable]

You've been taken to school on this fantasy of yours by multiple people, and not a single person has supported you.  Yet you continue to talk about it like it is objective fact.

That, in a nutshell, describes the process of being a neocon.  It's malevolence mixed with stupidity and ignorance.

It is an objective fact.  The oh so clever Libs have been using the term 'tea-bagger' to gay bait the Conservatives for years now.

And you decided to join in the fun with your posts.  Why continue lying about it? 

[PB the Deplorable]

... As to the comparison, how else would you describe a political movement that wants to take this country back to the days when only white property owners were allowed to vote, and slavery was not only accepted, but the idea that slaves were sub-human was formally acknowledged by the Constitution for purposes of apportioning representation in Congress?

And which political movement would that be?

[NowhereInTime]

And which political movement would that be?

Yours.

[Robert Ghostwolf's Ghost]

And which political movement would that be?

Oh, please.  You're much smarter than that.

[PB the Deplorable]

You are correct, Paperboy:  tea bagger is now pejorative in reference to those members of the Tea Party.  Why self-aware liberals use such wink-wink, nudge-nudge insults, I do not know.  It is silly and a bit juvenile.

May I assume you are equally bothered by the Something About Barry thread with all its far-more blatant homophobic horse shit?

I ask this of you because of all the conservative posters on this forum, you are IMO the most consistently civil.  Can we reach across the aisle on this point and acknowledge that it's all pretty immature and foolish?

The idea that Michelle is somehow a 'Tranny' and the kids being 'faked' and the rest of that is pretty lame and stupid.  I don't want to read or discuss that shit.  Maybe I just don't see the humor in it.   The same with the photo-shopped images of Barry on the thread you referred to. 

For a number of reasons I actually find this more annoying than 'teabagger' posts.  With the 'teabagger' comments, for me it's just me having a bit of fun pointing out the hypocrisy of a few sanctimonious posters who think they are being clever

I didn't respond to your post because I think there may be something to Obama being bisexual, so I couldn't answer the post with a blanket response saying I agreed it is all horse shit. 

It seems pretty odd to be all bent out of shape by the mocking use of "teabagger" and be fine with a whole thread suggesting that the FLOTUS is a tranny and another thread arguing the POTUS is a cross-dressing homosexual.

Strange, that....

Oh, I get it:  it is all just in good fun! (Except when you use "teabagger" -- then the gloves come off!)

Well, I did post the following when someone misinterpreted an earlier post of mine.  So no, I wasn't 'fine' with the threads in question.  To me this is all really lame, and I didn't even want to get into a discussion about it:

... Just so you know, I've never liked Joan Rivers or thought she was funny at all.

[PB the Deplorable]

Oh, please.  You're much smarter than that.

Well, the 'Progressives' are the ones always out giving African-American kids the message the whole country is racist and that they have no chance in life.  Judging from the results, they've been quite successful encouraging many of these kids to give up before they really even get started.

It's the 'Progressives' who have governed most of our big cities for the past 40-50 years, destroyed the inner city neighborhoods, and who show no signs of admitting their policies there have failed and admitting they should change course.

It's the far-Left America-hating Teachers Unions (not the teachers themselves) who seized control of our public schools and ensure the schools black Americans attend are terrible.


Then there is the history of the Democrat Party - the Party of slavery, of segregation, of Jim Crow, of the KKK.  The Party that interred the Japanese, and the Party that filibustered the Civil Rights Acts of 1957 and 1964.

It's the Democrats always counting noses, putting people in categories, encouraging race based identity politics, obsessing over race.


Based on your posts claiming that there is a group out there who want to return us to the days of slavery, and you're going to make me guess who it is, I'd have to pick the Liberal Left?

[Robert Ghostwolf's Ghost]

Well, the 'Progressives' are the ones always out giving African-American kids the message the whole country is racist and that they have no chance in life.  Judging from the results, they've been quite successful encouraging many of these kids to give up before they really even get started.

It's the 'Progressives' who have governed most of our big cities for the past 40-50 years, destroyed the inner city neighborhoods, and who show no signs of admitting their policies there have failed and admitting they should change course.

It's the far-Left America-hating Teachers Unions (not the teachers themselves) who seized control of our public schools and ensure the schools black Americans attend are terrible.


Then there is the history of the Democrat Party - the Party of slavery, of segregation, of Jim Crow, of the KKK.  The Party that interred the Japanese, and the Party that filibustered the Civil Rights Acts of 1957 and 1964.

It's the Democrats always counting noses, putting people in categories, encouraging race based identity politics, obsessing over race.


Based on your posts claiming that there is a group out there who want to return us to the days of slavery, and you're going to make me guess who it is, I'd have to pick the Liberal Left?

Now you're just trying to be cute.  We were talking about the Tea Party and you know it.  I understand members of the Democratic party have done some awful things and would never try to deny it.  I have no use for either major party, and I apologize for not conveniently fitting into one of your political pigeonholes.  Now please stay on topic, unless you're afraid to discuss it.  Do many members of the Tea Party want to return to the early days of this country and all that entails, or am I just misinterpreting their penchant for tri-corn hats, knee breeches, and Gadsden flags as some sort of dress up game?

BTW, those Democrats who filibustered the Civil Right Acts tended to be southerners who later became Republicans solely to show their displeasure with the passage of those acts. The reason they were Democrats in the first place was because they were still pissed off about Republican Abe Lincoln and that whole freeing of the slaves thing.  There. I dissed the Democrats and said something nice about Republicans.  Are you happy?

[NowhereInTime]

It's the far-Left America-hating Teachers Unions (not the teachers themselves) who seized control of our public schools and ensure the schools black Americans attend are terrible.

That's because the far-right American-hating States' Rights conservatives demand control of public education so they can promptly destroy it like the entire South and to miserable effect, Kansas.
If teachers dare disagree with obdurate good ole' boys in the statehouse they can (and are) fired without Union protection.  I wish we didn't have public employee unions, but when you sleazebag conservatives get your grimy claws on education (and educators) all you do is rip it (and them) apart.

Then there is the history of the Democrat Party - the Party of slavery, of segregation, of Jim Crow, of the KKK.  The Party that interred the Japanese, and the Party that filibustered the Civil Rights Acts of 1957 and 1964.

The party that submitted the legislation in the first place, passed it, signed it into law and promptly saw the racists leave the party (in droves - one of the last being that pig Richard Shelby from Allabammie in 1993) for the GOP and Nixon and Reagan's "Southern Strategy" and the Koch Brothers' Libertarian revolution.
Good riddance.

It's the Democrats {responding to people who are} always counting noses, putting people in categories, encouraging race based identity politics, obsessing over race.

Happily edited for you.

Based on your posts claiming that there is a group out there who want to return us to the days of slavery, and you're going to make me guess who it is, I'd have to pick the Liberal Left?

Sure, as long as you're wearing the red rubber nose, oversize shoes, and toot a horn every few seconds...

[PB the Deplorable]

Now you're just trying to be cute.  We were talking about the Tea Party and you know it...

...  Do many members of the Tea Party want to return to the early days of this country and all that entails, or am I just misinterpreting their penchant for tri-corn hats, knee breeches, and Gadsden flags as some sort of dress up game?...

Well, you may be talking about the Tea Party, but I don't recognize your description of them as 'racists' or agree with it at all.  Just because the Democrats and their allies in Big Media pump this garbage out ad nauseum, doesn't make it true or accurate.

They are saying they want their country back from the 'Progressives' - they don't want this bloated unrepresentative unresponsive federal government meddling in every aspect of our lives.  What they do want is to return to the small government, low tax, personal responsibility outlined in the Constitution.

So nothing about race at all. 

... BTW, those Democrats who filibustered the Civil Right Acts tended to be southerners who later became Republicans solely to show their displeasure with the passage of those acts...

Which of those filibustering Senators later became Republicans? 

Al Gore's dad, Senator from Tennessee?  Bill Clinton's mentor Senator William Fulbright (Arkansas)?  Former Klan leader Senator Robert Byrd (W Virginia) - who was a much venerated Senate leader for the next 50 years?


One of the astonishing things about all this was that the Northern Democrats didn't mind being in the same Party with their overtly racist colleagues.

[PB the Deplorable]

That's because the far-right American-hating States' Rights conservatives demand control of public education so they can promptly destroy it like the entire South and to miserable effect, Kansas...

Actually, they want to return control of the schools to local parents and teachers.  Who could possibly know better what's good for the kids - their own parents and teachers, or a bunch of Union honcho lobbyists with political agendas in Washington DC?

... If teachers dare disagree with obdurate good ole' boys in the statehouse they can (and are) fired without Union protection...

Yeah, that's the excuse.  Seldom the case though.

What does happen routinely is lousy teachers can't be fired without the district spending years and millions of dollars.

It's gotten so bad here in California that a court recently struck down tenure, and the US Sec of Education agreed with the decision.

http://www.latimes.com/local/education/la-me-teacher-lawsuit-20140611-story.html#page=1

[Gd5150]

It's been a bit of a bumpy ride.  First it was Global Cooling, then Global Warming, then Climate Change.  Now it's Climate Disruption.  Based on the data, it wouldn't surprise me to find it's back to Global Cooling.

You forgot peak oil, the ozone hole, to go along with cooling, warming, changing, unsettling. And the biggest surprise? Guess what the solution is? More government, more communism. Less capitalism. The same international workers party professional protestors show up to all the so-called environmental protests with their mass made preprinted signs. This debate was over 10 years ago.

[RealCool Daddio]

I'm just trying to figure out why a smart guy like Hawking would throw in with the people lying about climate change....
The 'scientists' have been caught discussing how to amplify data that supports them and how to suppress data that doesn't, on and on. 

The only people lying about climate change are right wing think tanks, largely funded by energy interests, posing as impartial journalists.

Hawking is "throwing in" with good old fashioned peer reviewed scientific evidence - nothing more  nothing less.  No accredited or recognized scientific body, organization, or research group has been caught in the manner you suggest (including the only one you ever site as an example, the East Anglia team).  Your doubts are based entirely on political ideology, not on empirical scientific evidence. 

Do you have any credible evidence to suggest that every major scientific body on the globe is politically biased, and only the handful of holdouts denying climate change have no bias at all?

[PB the Deplorable]

The only people lying about climate change are right wing think tanks, largely funded by energy interests, posing as impartial journalists.

Hawking is "throwing in" with good old fashioned peer reviewed scientific evidence - nothing more  nothing less.  No accredited or recognized scientific body, organization, or research group has been caught in the manner you suggest (including the only one you ever site as an example, the East Anglia team).  Your doubts are based entirely on political ideology, not on empirical scientific evidence. 

Do you have any credible evidence to suggest that every major scientific body on the globe is politically biased, and only the handful of holdouts denying climate change have no bias at all?

If it's peer reviewed it's news to me.  If I recall correctly the East Anglian gang illegally threw away the core data so that it couldn't be.

There is an enormous amount of conflicting data.   There apparently has been no raise in overall temperatures for the past 15 years, and no correlation between carbon in the atmosphere and global temps.  The predictions have been inaccurate.  Too many of their claims have turned out to be 'exaggerations' or 'mistakes'.  But most of all, the same people in our government I trust the least are the most insistent.

I'll freely admit I made up my mind a long time ago on this, and although I'm somewhat open to new info it would take a lot for me to change my mind - probably like everyone else posting here. 

Like I said recently, over the years the Libs have cried wolf too many times for me to take them seriously on much of anything anymore - and I'm suspicious of their motives on this or anything else.   But I don't set policy, so who cares.

[RealCool Daddio]

If it's peer reviewed it's news to me.  If I recall correctly the East Anglian gang illegally threw away the core data so that it couldn't be.

There is an enormous amount of conflicting data.   There apparently has been no raise in overall temperatures for the past 15 years, and no correlation between carbon in the atmosphere and global temps.  The predictions have been inaccurate.  Too many of their claims have turned out to be 'exaggerations' or 'mistakes'.  But most of all, the same people in our government I trust the least are the most insistent.

I'll freely admit I made up my mind a long time ago on this, and although I'm somewhat open to new info it would take a lot for me to change my mind - probably like everyone else posting here. 

Like I said recently, over the years the Libs have cried wolf too many times for me to take them seriously on much of anything anymore - and I'm suspicious of their motives on this or anything else.   But I don't set policy, so who cares.

You keep asserting these falsehoods, without providing any credible scientic sources.  Why don't you just admit that you either don't understand the basics of science, or that you don't believe in science at all ?

[Yorkshire pud]

You forgot peak oil, the ozone hole, to go along with cooling, warming, changing, unsettling. And the biggest surprise? Guess what the solution is? More government, more communism. Less capitalism.

...is an oxymoron. Communism...the clue is in the word...Commune. Collective. Co-operative of all working together for the common good, with no overall leader let alone government to control those within it.

[DigitalPigSnuggler]

over the years the Libs have cried wolf too many times

After YEARS of promising an alternative to Obamacare, the GOP finally presented one: the PCARE plan.  Unfortunately, it was very general and etch-a-sketchy as serious plans go, and once people started asking some serious questions about how the various parts work, the whole thing fell apart, and was revealed for what it REALLY is -- a talking point, something that the right can use as a soundbite to claim that they DO have a plan.  And if only that fuckin Muslim nigra in the White House would stop blocking it, they could wheel it out to the American people.

Earlier this year, John Boehner promised "big movement" on the immigration front.  Legislation this year, he said.  This time fer shure!!  But then...the fuckin teabaggers came out of the woodwork and screamed like a pig being chased by a naked Quick Karl.  And just like that, immigration reform fell of the docket for this year.

And then there are the phony "scandals."

Iraq: After fucking the country in the ass by invading Iraq, the neocons are now blaming all of the CURRENT turmoil there on (wait for it) Obama.  NO Americans died in Iraq last year, or this year.  Had we elected either of the two opponents to Obama in the last two elections, we would likely have another 5,000 Americans killed in Iraq for no reason.  Yep, it's a scandal all right -- Obama ended the neocons war of choice ("We don't want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud")

IRS: Under Obama (who else?), the IRS is now "persecuting" groups dedicated to being involved in elections with that expressed intent.  Why?  Because the IRS is (rightfully) enforcing the law that tax-exempt non-profits can't be directly involved in political campaigns.  But forget all that: it's Obama oppressing the teabaggers again.  That's all you need to know.

Benghazi: Certainly a sad and tragic event for all Americans -- except for the right wing, who are wetting themselves with excitement over having some swift-boat material to use when they lie to the public in the next Presidential election.  And for extra fun, how about some heavy innuendo about nutbag conspiracies connection the administration and terrorism?  He's a Muslim, you know, 72% of them approve of him, so it must be so.   Also, he ain't white.  PDQ

Obamacare: Say, what happened to those death panels, anyway? 

Ayep, this is just a sampling of wolf-crying over the YEAR (not years) by the neocons.  See no evil is all you need to know.

[albrecht]

Obamacare: Say, what happened to those death panels, anyway? 

Currently the death panels are being tested out at the VA, apparently. It has come out that several have used secret "waiting lists" in hopes that the veterans will die-off and thus save the administration some money and give the bureaucrats in charge of the local VAs bonuses for through-put and meeting numbers.

[DigitalPigSnuggler]

It has come out that several have used secret "waiting lists" in hopes that the veterans will die-off and thus save the administration some money

Has it "come out" elsewhere besides in the wet dreams of neocon shitheads?  You know, something reputable?

[albrecht]

Has it "come out" elsewhere besides in the wet dreams of neocon shitheads?  You know, something reputable?

Well Secretary Eric Shinseki stepped down on account of it. Now I'm not alleging that Obama personally instructed the "waiting lists" but just that he ignored all the VA problems because he would much rather spend billions on illegal aliens, as he requested just this week, than take care of our veterans. The "waiting lists" were more likely not official policy but simply what happens when you centralize healthcare into a bureacracy and have incentives for through-put etc for the administrators.

Simply look up:
August 17, 2010 VA Office of Inspector General (OIG) report entitled “Review of Alleged Use of Unauthorized Wait Lists at the Portland VA Medical Center"

from a more "right-wing" Republican source:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/23/veterans_n_5202160.html

And here is Obama demanding more money for illegals:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/09/us/obama-seeks-billions-for-children-immigration-crisis.html?_r=0
he is even using US tax-payer money to buy things like games, like Monopoly, for his illegals.

[onan]

The VA scandal is the antithesis of Obamacare. The underfunding, leading to under staffing, and not improving a 30+ year antiquated computer system were the causes that engendered those wait lists.

Vets have been complaining over long waits for more than 2 decades. Where was the outrage when Bush senior started cutting funding?

[albrecht]

The VA scandal is the antithesis of Obamacare. The underfunding, leading to under staffing, and not improving a 30+ year antiquated computer system were the causes that engendered those wait lists.

Vets have been complaining over long waits for more than 2 decades. Where was the outrage when Bush senior started cutting funding?

There was a lot, though not enough and then were quickly over shadowed by other "breaking" news stories. Recall the shitty Walter Reed hospital scandal? Recall the Gulf War Syndrome stuff even? Or that crazy retained-asset accounts policy for dead vets and outsourcing them to private companies that aren't even FDIC insured (WITHOUT informing the beneficiaries?)
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-09-14/veterans-agency-arranged-secret-deal-with-prudential-over-soldier-benefits.html

The fact is that the government for a long time seems to not care about veterans once they are no longer useful. (Remember the Bonus Army and how they were treated?) And even up to today people are kicked out of the services on questionable medical reasons or for "misconduct" (for example substance abuse likely caused by injuries or the over-prescription of drug or PTSD) so that they can't get benefits or help.

[PB the Deplorable]

The VA scandal is the antithesis of Obamacare. The underfunding, leading to under staffing, and not improving a 30+ year antiquated computer system were the causes that engendered those wait lists.

Vets have been complaining over long waits for more than 2 decades. Where was the outrage when Bush senior started cutting funding?

It's not really about Obama or Bush or any administration. 

The government is never going to produce goods and services as efficiently as the private sector.  It's an impossibility due to human nature.  The profit motive is often too easily dismissed.  The Left has been very successful telling us corporations are bad, profits are bad, the wealthy are bad, free exchange (Capitalism) is bad.  The people who believe government is always the answer are too quick to believe that.

If we take the profit motive out and just fund whatever it is with tax money, it soon typically becomes someone's 'empire', complete with too many people hired, too many 'managers'.  There is little incentive to control waste and fraud, let alone normal costs.


Anyone who doesn't think government funded health care won't be more of the same - underfunded in essential areas, over hiring and over budget in other areas, poor prioritization, over involvement of politics, and all the rest are kidding themselves.

[PB the Deplorable]

After YEARS of promising an alternative to Obamacare, the GOP finally presented one: the PCARE plan.  Unfortunately, it was very general and etch-a-sketchy as serious plans go, and once people started asking some serious questions about how the various parts work, the whole thing fell apart, and was revealed for what it REALLY is -- a talking point, something that the right can use as a soundbite to claim that they DO have a plan.  And if only that fuckin Muslim nigra in the White House would stop blocking it, they could wheel it out to the American people.

Earlier this year, John Boehner promised "big movement" on the immigration front.  Legislation this year, he said.  This time fer shure!!  But then...the fuckin teabaggers came out of the woodwork and screamed like a pig being chased by a naked Quick Karl.  And just like that, immigration reform fell of the docket for this year.

And then there are the phony "scandals."

Iraq: After fucking the country in the ass by invading Iraq, the neocons are now blaming all of the CURRENT turmoil there on (wait for it) Obama.  NO Americans died in Iraq last year, or this year.  Had we elected either of the two opponents to Obama in the last two elections, we would likely have another 5,000 Americans killed in Iraq for no reason.  Yep, it's a scandal all right -- Obama ended the neocons war of choice ("We don't want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud")

IRS: Under Obama (who else?), the IRS is now "persecuting" groups dedicated to being involved in elections with that expressed intent.  Why?  Because the IRS is (rightfully) enforcing the law that tax-exempt non-profits can't be directly involved in political campaigns.  But forget all that: it's Obama oppressing the teabaggers again.  That's all you need to know.

Benghazi: Certainly a sad and tragic event for all Americans -- except for the right wing, who are wetting themselves with excitement over having some swift-boat material to use when they lie to the public in the next Presidential election.  And for extra fun, how about some heavy innuendo about nutbag conspiracies connection the administration and terrorism?  He's a Muslim, you know, 72% of them approve of him, so it must be so.   Also, he ain't white.  PDQ

Obamacare: Say, what happened to those death panels, anyway? 

Ayep, this is just a sampling of wolf-crying over the YEAR (not years) by the neocons.  See no evil is all you need to know.

No, you're not spoon fed your news by the Lib Media, not at all.

[NowhereInTime]

No, you're not spoon fed your news by the Lib Media, not at all.

Right.  From the man who get his news from Drudge, Breitbart,  and those voices in his head telling him "they're all whores who need to die!"
I bet you're the Zodiac.

[NowhereInTime]

After YEARS of promising an alternative to Obamacare, the GOP finally presented one: the PCARE plan.  Unfortunately, it was very general and etch-a-sketchy as serious plans go, and once people started asking some serious questions about how the various parts work, the whole thing fell apart, and was revealed for what it REALLY is -- a talking point,

Oh. My. God.
How dare you?!?
Are you so naive as to not understand how "cut taxes, less government" is the cure-all for what ails you?
Heathen.

[DigitalPigSnuggler]

Oh. My. God.
How dare you?!?
Are you so naive as to not understand how "cut taxes, less government" is the cure-all for what ails you?
Heathen.

I'd LIKE to up my game, really I would, but the Lib Media has me tied down and is force-feeding me "their" version of the news.

So what's the difference?  The neocons don't need to be tied down.  They are lining up.