What will come of this shooting in France?

[Gd5150]

Are you sure?

Because if I remember correctly, you said you identified the young charismatic Senator from Illinois very early in the campaign for the 2008 Democrat Presidential nomination - to support and campaign for.  At that very same time, Barack Obama was quite clear in his opposition to gay 'marriage'. 

In fact he snubbed the mayor of San Francisco multiple times - the man who kicked this whole thing off by issuing 'marriage' licenses to gays at the San Francisco County Clerks Office - over this very issue.  Obama refused to be photographed or even seen with Mayor Gavin Newsome during the entire campaign, and he had many chances because he visited San Francisco often to raise funds.

The rift between the Obama and Newsome tribes within the Democrat Party that started then remains to this day.

It wasn't until a Biden gaffe in 2012 forced the issue, and it seemed like Obama felt he had no choice but to come out in favor of gay 'marriage'.  For political expediency when put on the spot by his VP.


Keep in mind this is a person who chose Rev Jeremiah Wright as a mentor.  Rev Wright is an angry man who apparently hates anyone who is not like him.  Since Barak was against gay 'marriage', almost surely he and Rev Wright were in agreement.  Almost certainly he still opposes it personally. 

Even if he is all for it now on a personal level now, how is it you could have supported a person like this back in 2008 - and continued that support into 2012 before he 'changed his mind' - given your views and comments above?

Shame on you for judging Obama by his words, actions, associations, and results of his policies. It's unfair, judgemental, and most shameful of all, intolerant. It' has already been concluded that there is overwhelming consensus from his supporters who support him that his intentions are what he intends.

[NowhereInTime]

Are you sure?

Sadly, yes. Intransigence and resistance to changing of the status quo (status conservatives can manipulate and control, ergo their desire maintain such) are the very hallmarks of conservative belief and thought.  The antithesis of Progressives.

Because if I remember correctly, you said you identified the young charismatic Senator from Illinois very early in the campaign for the 2008 Democrat Presidential nomination - to support and campaign for.  At that very same time, Barack Obama was quite clear in his opposition to gay 'marriage'.

Thank you for making my point for me.  Again.  Barry O did, in fact, publicly oppose gay marriage. He has since (also publicly) changed (something abhorrent to conservatism) his opinion (at least re: public policy) when he bothered to learn that gays and gay marriage weren't going to bring down either a) the Wrath of God or b) the republic.

This is a fundamental difference between progressives, who want to see equal opportunity for all and conservatives, who want to create an advantageous social order and do so by scapegoating "others" who are "different" or "not like us".

In fact he snubbed the mayor of San Francisco multiple times - the man who kicked this whole thing off by issuing 'marriage' licenses to gays at the San Francisco County Clerks Office - over this very issue.  Obama refused to be photographed or even seen with Mayor Gavin Newsome during the entire campaign, and he had many chances because he visited San Francisco often to raise funds.

The rift between the Obama and Newsome tribes within the Democrat Party that started then remains to this day.

Most Democrats in public office have complained about Barry "spurning" them or not giving them the love they craved.  Truth is this is Barry's biggest flaw; as a politician he relies on things like "truth" and "common sense" to rule the day when dealing with creatures of emotion.  It's a flaw.

It wasn't until a Biden gaffe in 2012 forced the issue, and it seemed like Obama felt he had no choice but to come out in favor of gay 'marriage'.

Forced? Again your ignorance of how the world works is truly astounding. (Still want to argue how speculators had nothing to do with running up oil prices to ungodly levels?  See how they run for the door on rumors of oversupply?  How much is oil now? $46 a barrel? Facts matter.)


The Biden "gaffe" was the opening Obama needed (much like the Reverend Wright controversy) to address a sensitive social issue without coming off as a radical. 

For political expediency when put on the spot by his VP.

For political convenience, when using his VP to throw open the door for him.

Keep in mind this is a person who chose Rev Jeremiah Wright as a mentor.  Rev Wright is an angry man who apparently hates anyone who is not like him.  Since Barak was against gay 'marriage', almost surely he and Rev Wright were in agreement.  Almost certainly he still opposes it personally.

Asked and answered.  I don't feel like being rude again, but your simple side is showing.

Even if he is all for it now on a personal level now, how is it you could have supported a person like this back in 2008 - and continued that support into 2012 before he 'changed his mind' - given your views and comments above?

Simple.  He's a human being.  He's allowed to learn.  He's allowed to grow.  He's allowed to let experience guide him.  He's not bound hard and fast to ignorant and limited principles meant to simplify things (because your head starts to hurt when things change "too fast").


That and I knew he was, in fact, an transformative figure who could be won over, rather than a conservative stalwart bent on scaring the flock to keep his power.


Try thinking through things something sometime.  Nuance, diplomacy, growth, experience; all of these (and many other factors) are what true leadership is about, not steadfast adherence to uninformed (often misinterpreted) "principles" that don't permit for that great variable known as humanity.


Still holding out hope for you.

[Mind Flayer Monk]

Well the story grows. wu qiao bu cheng shu 無巧不成書 “without coincidence there is no good story.

Apparently, one of the investigators of the murders has committed suicide.

Charlie Hebdo top cop Helric Fredou kills himself hours after magazine massacre
The 45-year-old was investigating the devastating terrorist attack at Charlie Hebdo magazine when he killed himself.
A senior French police officer investigating the Charlie Hebdo magazine massacre killed himself just hours after the horrific terror attack.
It has been reported that shortly before committing suicide Commissioner Fredou had met with the family of one of the victims of the Charlie Hebdo attack massacre.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/charlie-hebdo-top-cop-helric-4963644

[PB the Deplorable]

Sadly, yes. Intransigence and resistance to changing of the status quo (status conservatives can manipulate and control, ergo their desire maintain such) are the very hallmarks of conservative belief and thought.  The antithesis of Progressives.



Thank you for making my point for me.  Again.  Barry O did, in fact, publicly oppose gay marriage. He has since (also publicly) changed (something abhorrent to conservatism) his opinion (at least re: public policy) when he bothered to learn that gays and gay marriage weren't going to bring down either a) the Wrath of God or b) the republic.

This is a fundamental difference between progressives, who want to see equal opportunity for all and conservatives, who want to create an advantageous social order and do so by scapegoating "others" who are "different" or "not like us".



Most Democrats in public office have complained about Barry "spurning" them or not giving them the love they craved.  Truth is this is Barry's biggest flaw; as a politician he relies on things like "truth" and "common sense" to rule the day when dealing with creatures of emotion.  It's a flaw.


Forced? Again your ignorance of how the world works is truly astounding. (Still want to argue how speculators had nothing to do with running up oil prices to ungodly levels?  See how they run for the door on rumors of oversupply?  How much is oil now? $46 a barrel? Facts matter.)


The Biden "gaffe" was the opening Obama needed (much like the Reverend Wright controversy) to address a sensitive social issue without coming off as a radical. 



For political convenience, when using his VP to throw open the door for him.


Asked and answered.  I don't feel like being rude again, but your simple side is showing.


Simple.  He's a human being.  He's allowed to learn.  He's allowed to grow.  He's allowed to let experience guide him.  He's not bound hard and fast to ignorant and limited principles meant to simplify things (because your head starts to hurt when things change "too fast").


That and I knew he was, in fact, an transformative figure who could be won over, rather than a conservative stalwart bent on scaring the flock to keep his power.


Try thinking through things something sometime.  Nuance, diplomacy, growth, experience; all of these (and many other factors) are what true leadership is about, not steadfast adherence to uninformed (often misinterpreted) "principles" that don't permit for that great variable known as humanity.


Still holding out hope for you.

That's sure a lot of words just to say anyone not in support of gay 'marriage' is automatically an 'intolerant' Conservative, unless they are a 'Progressive' Democrat.

[NowhereInTime]

That's sure a lot of words just to say anyone not in support of gay 'marriage' is automatically an 'intolerant' Conservative, unless they are a 'Progressive' Democrat.

Well let me simplify it for you; conservatives are greedy cynics who use fear and must contrast themselves against others. Progressives are positive thinking altruistic humanists who proudly stand for these principles. They do not need to contrast themselves against "others" to try to look appealing.

Still too much? Ok.

Conservative = con = against. Against other people. Against opportunity. Against dignity. Against peace.

Progressive = pro = forward. Forward with human rights and civil rights. Forward with education and access to resources. Forward with economic growth for all, not just those already swimming in lucre.

Conservatives are against gay marriage because they are against anyone or anything that challenges their orthodoxy, status, and, frankly, self-esteem. ( Now tune into Rush. He'll make it all better.)

Progressives believe all people should have equal opportunities and that status is irrelevant.

Think this nails it down succinctly. Thanks for playing.

[Bart Ell]

Now we know what will come of this shooting in France thread. It will go gay. Some will say anything from France starts off gay, they just hate cheese... and oil on pizza.

[PB the Deplorable]

... Progressives are positive thinking altruistic humanists who proudly stand for these principles...

Can you come out here and explain that to our 'Progressives'?

Because people are tired of having them looting, burning cars and businesses, and attacking the police during their 'demonstrations'.  More tiresome are their newest grand ideas:  blocking freeways, shutting down BART (the commuter trains).  You know, because mob rule is preferable to Democracy. 

All in the name of altruistic humanistic 'Progressive' principles.  Which appear to mostly be that the United States is an evil country, founded on evil by evil men, that must be destroyed and rebuilt into something more similar to a socialistic third world dictatorship.  With them in charge, of course.

If you can make it out here and point them away from their actions, and toward their rhetoric, there's a beer in it for you.

[Kelt]

Surely if all the progressives are out looting and burning then all the conservatives are out peering in people's bedroom windows and murdering abortion clinic workers.

[RealCool Daddio]

Surely if all the progressives are out looting and burning then all the conservatives are out peering in people's bedroom windows and murdering abortion clinic workers.

6 days a week, they are.  Today is Sunday, so they are in church learning science. Afterwards, they clean their guns.

[Delphi]

Yeah im not so sure about the intolerance to gay marriage. .. I mean come on now

[Yorkshire pud]

Yeah im not so sure about the intolerance to gay marriage. .. I mean come on now

To quote the line by Will Macavoy in Newsroom: I'm a Republcan; I only seem liberal becauseI believe hurricanes are caused by barometric pressure, and not gay marriage.

[FightTheFuture]

6 days a week, they are.  Today is Sunday, so they are in church learning science. Afterwards, they clean their guns.

NEGATIVE.


SATURDAY is reserved for the cleaning of weapons. Sunday, after church, is reserved for the enjoyment of the great American pastime of Pro Football.


Carry on.

[Delphi]

Haha that's great

[RealCool Daddio]

To quote the line by Will Macavoy in Newsroom: I'm a Republcan; I only seem liberal becauseI believe hurricanes are caused by barometric pressure, and not gay marriage.

Sane and tolerant Republicans do exist.  PaperBoy calls them Rinos's.

[Zoo]

12 people die and people lose their mind and everyone is all about France. Over 2,000 die in Nigeria and nobody gives a shit. Nobody said shit about it because? Well we all know in our hearts why. Nobody gives a fuck about Africa even though Nigeria is the tenth largest producer of OIL. You would think we be all about that but nope we do not give a fuck about YOU!!1

http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/09/africa/boko-haram-violence/

[albrecht]

12 people die and people lose their mind and everyone is all about France. Over 2,000 die in Nigeria and nobody gives a shit. Nobody said shit about it because? Well we all know in our hearts why. Nobody gives a fuck about Africa even though Nigeria is the tenth largest producer of OIL. You would think we be all about that but nope we do not give a fuck about YOU!!1

http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/09/africa/boko-haram-violence/

The USA, and increasingly China, is fairly present in Africa, as well as their former colonialist countries. You seem to misinterpret trying to save people, especially Christians or non-Muslims under our current leader, with issues related to rare earth minerals, hydrocarbons, or hegemony. They are not linked unless absolutely necessary to do so.

[PB the Deplorable]

12 people die and people lose their mind and everyone is all about France. Over 2,000 die in Nigeria and nobody gives a shit. Nobody said shit about it because? Well we all know in our hearts why. Nobody gives a fuck about Africa even though Nigeria is the tenth largest producer of OIL. You would think we be all about that but nope we do not give a fuck about YOU!!1

I agree with you more people should be aware of Boko Harum and upset about what they are doing in Nigeria.  I think we agree more people should be aware and upset about what's going on in our own country (but not to the point they are constantly focused on it and angry all the time - that will just sour a person, and eventually affect their health)

I think the reason is 1) the media hypes certain stories and downplays others due to various factors, 2) people just expect a certain amount of turmoil, political violence, mass slaughter, and catastrophes from the third world, but not the 'West' and 3) something happening in, say, Nigeria, isn't something people relate to the way a terrorist attack in the streets of, say, Paris is.

[Zoo]

Well you make some good points. I think we just because nobody gives a fuck about poor black people. It is just not good NEWS not like flat footballs I mean shit someone cheated in sports. Say it is not so my world is crushed!!1

[NowhereInTime]

Well you make some good points. I think we just because nobody gives a fuck about poor black people. It is just not good NEWS not like flat footballs I mean shit someone cheated in sports. Say it is not so my world is crushed!!1

The lazy ass media serves ratings (and nothing else); black-on-black crime never rates, especially national newscasts.  Cynical?  Of course.


Boko Haram should be destroyed.

[Robert Ghostwolf's Ghost]

I think we agree more people should be aware and upset about what's going on in our own country (but not to the point they are constantly focused on it and angry all the time - that will just sour a person, and eventually affect their health)

That's very sound advice.  You'll feel much better if you follow it.

[Yorkshire pud]

That's very sound advice.  You'll feel much better if you follow it.

I will have a wager; one English groat it last's a full day and a half.

[Yorkshire pud]

Well you make some good points. I think we just because nobody gives a fuck about poor black people. It is just not good NEWS not like flat footballs I mean shit someone cheated in sports. Say it is not so my world is crushed!!1

You're deliberately overlooking the question on EVERYONE'S lips; Has Kim Karadadadadadadadasn got a bigger arse than last week...well has she?

[Zoo]

You're deliberately overlooking the question on EVERYONE'S lips; Has Kim Karadadadadadadadasn got a bigger arse than last week...well has she?

LMFAO Americans are so fucking dumb it makes me sick. I was in class today and had to show a senior where Nigeria(Africa) was on a map. He is going to be something special like a Congressman or even President I can feel it. We are so fucking doomed!!1