***BREAKING*** Explosion in NYC

[Value Of Pi]

Thanks for your response.  I don't think it explains how 7 fell into it's footprint which is what you try do do in demolition. Also apparently they have some guy saying 'pull it' which I guess is demo talk for setting off the charges to pull down a building. Also there are interviews with firemen and you can hear blasts coming from the background.


I'm not saying I believe in this theory I do have questions about the story we have been given.

No problem. I'm okay with not needing to explain all the things that people wonder about where 9/11 is concerned. In this case, did Building 7 actually collapse in the way some allege? If so, what exactly would it be evidence of? Always question the premise before you start worrying about conclusions.

[Roswells, Art]

No problem. I'm okay with not needing to explain all the things that people wonder about where 9/11 is concerned. In this case, did Building 7 actually collapse in the way some allege? If so, what exactly would it be evidence of? Always question the premise before you start worrying about conclusions.

Here is a video I found of different perspectives of building 7 collapsing. Keep in mind, this building didn't get hit by anything:



https://youtu.be/bWorDrTC0Qg


I don't know why they would want to do something like that. Though Cheney, who was Vice President at the time used to be CEO of Halliburton and I think Halliburton got most of the contracts to rebuild Iraq after we bombed the shit out of them. Also a lot of what they did was not necessary, but they still got paid for it... by us.


George Bush seemed to have a vendetta against Saddam as well because "after all this is the guy that tried to kill my dad at one time".

[Value Of Pi]

Here is a video I found of different perspectives of building 7 collapsing:



https://youtu.be/bWorDrTC0Qg


I don't know why they would want to do something like that. Though Cheney, who was Vice President at the time used to be CEO of Halliburton and I think Halliburton got most of the contracts to rebuild Iraq after we bombed the shit out of them. Also a lot of what they did was not necessary, but they still got paid for it... by us.

A much more remarkable, meaningful and horrendous event happened when terrorists flew planes into the wtc and knocked down both towers, killing 3,000 people. Building 7 had no people in it when it later collapsed after a massive fire. So frankly, focusing on Building 7 is the worthless obsession of a few conspiracy nuts and doesn't merit much attention from the rest of us, especially during the 15-year commemoration of the attacks. That's my feeling.

[norland2424]

A much more remarkable, meaningful and horrendous event happened when terrorists flew planes into the wtc and knocked down both towers, killing 3,000 people. Building 7 had no people in it when it later collapsed after a massive fire. So frankly, focusing on Building 7 is the worthless obsession of a few conspiracy nuts and doesn't merit much attention from the rest of us, especially during the 15-year commemoration of the attacks. That's my feeling.

this +1000

[Roswells, Art]

A much more remarkable, meaningful and horrendous event happened when terrorists flew planes into the wtc and knocked down both towers, killing 3,000 people. Building 7 had no people in it when it later collapsed after a massive fire. So frankly, focusing on Building 7 is the worthless obsession of a few conspiracy nuts and doesn't merit much attention from the rest of us, especially during the 15-year commemoration of the attacks. That's my feeling.

Yeah, it was and is horrible. All I am saying is that the collapse of building seven which you can see in the video I posted seems to be a clue that things aren't what they told us. Your thinking seems to stop at the tragedy that was the world trade center buildings. Just because I'm looking at another building doesn't mean I don't feel for the people that died. I don't think it is a worthless obsession...well actually it is because if what we were told were lies than what could I do anyway? Actually you're right. Believing everything is wonderful is much better. I'll go with that.

[Roswells, Art]

this +1000

that -1001

[akwilly]

that -1001

FYI Hoagy has the 911 lady on tonight.

[Evil Twin Of Zen]

I'll read it all but I think the premise of the first one you posted is not what we are talking about:


'Did firefighters abandon their fallen brothers to help Larry Silverstein demolish a skyscraper that had sustained minor damage and fires?'


I'll read that huge manuscript you posted though and get back to you. Did you read it? If so just give us the part that is important to our conversation.


That video though...it looks like a plane went into a building, not demolition.


No way they could have timed demolition to go off right when that plane hit.

the posted link covers many aspects of the buildings involved.

the pdf document is an examination of CT claims and a debunking of those claims with evidence. yes i've read it. the majority of it falls well within the conversation AND the claims our resident CTer will be making following the posting of it.

there is tons of video footage on youtube. i recommend avoiding footage used with commentary from one side or the other. i have seen a lot of footage from CTers that is doctored and edited in an attempt to fit their claims. raw footage seems to be best. the avi i posted shows very clearly how much damage that airliner did... it ripped into the tower.

WTC 7 had huge storage tanks of fuel inside. the south side was heavily damaged and being gutted by fire. the building was evacuated because they expected it to collapse, it was leaning and once the penthouse structure collapsed into the building... that was that...

i do not believe the government did this, but they sure exploited any and all political advantage they could get from it. the CT crowd is only helping them. not much difference between the CTers, BLM, Nazis, Birthers, KKK, SJW, Extreme Right, Extreme Left, etc. in that regard.

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” ― Isaac Asimov

Peace

[Evil Twin Of Zen]

Here is a video I found of different perspectives of building 7 collapsing. Keep in mind, this building didn't get hit by anything:



https://youtu.be/bWorDrTC0Qg


I don't know why they would want to do something like that. Though Cheney, who was Vice President at the time used to be CEO of Halliburton and I think Halliburton got most of the contracts to rebuild Iraq after we bombed the shit out of them. Also a lot of what they did was not necessary, but they still got paid for it... by us.


George Bush seemed to have a vendetta against Saddam as well because "after all this is the guy that tried to kill my dad at one time".

wow... just wow...
not one of those perspectives showed the east penthouse collapse INTO the building that was the start of the collapse. i wonder why? of course, some perspectives wouldn't show it, but most of those in the vid had it edited out(starting where the entire building collapsed). the complete videos that do show it also show evidence that it went thru several of the floors as it fell inside.

warning: text commentary in vid that disputes CTers timing claims. don't really have to watch it much further than seeing the complete collapse in the first few minutes to see what i'm talking about. 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkKgLKyhqHk

[Roswells, Art]

the posted link covers many aspects of the buildings involved.

the pdf document is an examination of CT claims and a debunking of those claims with evidence. yes i've read it. the majority of it falls well within the conversation AND the claims our resident CTer will be making following the posting of it.

there is tons of video footage on youtube. i recommend avoiding footage used with commentary from one side or the other. i have seen a lot of footage from CTers that is doctored and edited in an attempt to fit their claims. raw footage seems to be best. the avi i posted shows very clearly how much damage that airliner did... it ripped into the tower.

WTC 7 had huge storage tanks of fuel inside. the south side was heavily damaged and being gutted by fire. the building was evacuated because they expected it to collapse, it was leaning and once the penthouse structure collapsed into the building... that was that...

i do not believe the government did this, but they sure exploited any and all political advantage they could get from it. the CT crowd is only helping them. not much difference between the CTers, BLM, Nazis, Birthers, KKK, SJW, Extreme Right, Extreme Left, etc. in that regard.

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” ― Isaac Asimov

Peace

Thanks for the response. I wasn't looking to argue, just ask questions and I think you answered them for me. I'll check out that document you posted.

[Value Of Pi]

the posted link covers many aspects of the buildings involved.

the pdf document is an examination of CT claims and a debunking of those claims with evidence. yes i've read it. the majority of it falls well within the conversation AND the claims our resident CTer will be making following the posting of it.

there is tons of video footage on youtube. i recommend avoiding footage used with commentary from one side or the other. i have seen a lot of footage from CTers that is doctored and edited in an attempt to fit their claims. raw footage seems to be best. the avi i posted shows very clearly how much damage that airliner did... it ripped into the tower.

WTC 7 had huge storage tanks of fuel inside. the south side was heavily damaged and being gutted by fire. the building was evacuated because they expected it to collapse, it was leaning and once the penthouse structure collapsed into the building... that was that...

i do not believe the government did this, but they sure exploited any and all political advantage they could get from it. the CT crowd is only helping them. not much difference between the CTers, BLM, Nazis, Birthers, KKK, SJW, Extreme Right, Extreme Left, etc. in that regard.

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” ― Isaac Asimov

Peace

That is one of the great quotes. The point Asimov made was never more true than it is today. I would add that it's easy to make a rational argument against irrationality (which is how the anti-intellectualism gets expressed). The trouble is, nobody who is being irrational can understand the argument. All you can do is hope for a lucid moment.

[Evil Twin Of Zen]

Thanks for the response. I wasn't looking to argue, just ask questions and I think you answered them for me. I'll check out that document you posted.

no argument from me. my response wasn't meant to read that way. i have very little patience for those (obviously not you) that refuse to even consider anything other than the fact the earth is flat. 

you could also check out info as to why buildings fall. plenty of raw vid of earthquake damage and collapse of buildings. many seem to pretty much fall on top of themselves. many times well after the quake.

i won't pretend to understand all the math, but i do understand dynamic loads compared to static loads where buildings are concerned.

i am an idiot when it comes to space based energy weapons zapping buildings..... 

[Value Of Pi]

wow... just wow...
not one of those perspectives showed the east penthouse collapse INTO the building that was the start of the collapse. i wonder why? of course, some perspectives wouldn't show it, but most of those in the vid had it edited out(starting where the entire building collapsed). the complete videos that do show it also show evidence that it went thru several of the floors as it fell inside.

warning: text commentary in vid that disputes CTers timing claims. don't really have to watch it much further than seeing the complete collapse in the first few minutes to see what i'm talking about. 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkKgLKyhqHk

Well, if someone starts out with a belief that we must have been lied to by lying liars, they might be tempted to edit the available evidence in order to help spread that suspicion and belief.. That's what's going on here with building 7.

A reasonably objective reporter, on the other hand, would simply ask what, where, why, who and how, then proceed from there, without a pre-conceived agenda. Open mind, closed mind, round world, flat world, the integrity of the methodology and reasoning is what matters when asking "What's the story here?"

[SredniVashtar]

I put 9/11 conspiracy theories in the same basket as the majority of UFO sightings. Just as most UFOs are almost certainly experimental aircraft - and the authorities encourage speculation about aliens to divert attention from what is really going on - it wouldn't surprise me if the theories about explosives were seeded to take the heat off the real story. There was probably shocking incompetence by various agencies of one kind or another, and they didn't want it coming to light. There is always a witch-hunt after events like this and they needed a suitable scapegoat. What better sideshow than creating a fuss about something absurd that will occupy the attention of a few obsessives and make the idea of questioning any aspect of 9/11 ridiculous? It will go nowhere, and after a few years of fruitless navel-gazing people will get bored of the whole subject and move on. And that's exactly what has happened.

After all, what possible sense would there be to rig explosives in the towers in the first place? You already saw two planes crashing into skyscrapers. That's enough, in propaganda terms, and anything else is just gilding the lily.

[Robert]

Thanks for your response.  I don't think it explains how 7 fell into it's footprint which is what you try do do in demolition.

Law of gravity?  Is that supposed to be a hard question?  We define "down" by gravity.

Also apparently they have some guy saying 'pull it' which I guess is demo talk for setting off the charges to pull down a building.

I heard the same statements.  Apparently it was their intention to demolish it, but it came down w/o their having to.

The fall of Bldg. 7 was very significant to me & others because of the breaking of phone lines that went under it.  Really messed up voice & Internet a long time after.  For a good while afterward I'd assumed Bldg. 7 had been brought down as planned, until it was pointed out such a demolition could not have happened that soon afterward.  Hence the belief it had been previously planned & arranged for.  However, I now believe that, given its type of construction and all the shaking produced by the fall of the towers, that it was spontaneous.  It's not that unusual for experts looking at a bldg. to determine that it will fall very soon, and for them turn out amazingly right.  There are stories of various bldgs. being evacuated with just hours or even minutes to spare.

Also there are interviews with firemen and you can hear blasts coming from the background.

Loud sounds are different over the radio or phone.  Last night I was on the phone w a friend, who asked whether I heard a loud background sound.  I certainly did, but was surprised when she said it was an unmuffled road vehicle, because to me it sounded more like a continuous roar like a jet engine.

[Robert]

This morning on WOR I heard very discomforting discussion.  Apparently the ostensible bomber had been noticed by family to have changed his behavior in recent time, with his travel back to Asia.  The changes were summed up as a marked increase in piety, and the same changes were said to have been noted by family in the San Bernardino shooting case.  The discussion was that these indications should have been used in some way to try to prevent terrorism.

This is disturbing 2 ways.  One is just the fact of increasing Islamic piety being taken as a leading indicator of terrorism, possibly enough to act prophylactically on.  The other way is if the connection is indeed a reliable indicator.

[albrecht]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/21/nyregion/ahmad-khan-rahami-suspect.html?_r=0
Like many of Obama's other Muslims the police and government were aware of him and his own DAD even told the police, who then informed the FBI, that his son was a terrorist and wrote about killing the kaffur [sic.] But, likely due to political correctness or government incompetence, this, as so many other Muslim terrorists, he was allowed by Obama's government to do his peace. Thankfully in this latest of case the Muslim was incompetent and his bombs didn't kill anyone. The government says they need access to all our emails, phone calls, location, Internet traffic, license plate scanning, TSA groping, gun purchases, financial transactions, and, with Obamacare, even health records etc but, yet again, can't, or won't, catch a Muslim terrorist and instead let him do his peace? I also want an update on the other Muslims caught in the car supposedly armed on the way to the airport. Silence there.

[Dr. MD MD]

I put 9/11 conspiracy theories in the same basket as the majority of UFO sightings. Just as most UFOs are almost certainly experimental aircraft - and the authorities encourage speculation about aliens to divert attention from what is really going on - it wouldn't surprise me if the theories about explosives were seeded to take the heat off the real story. There was probably shocking incompetence by various agencies of one kind or another, and they didn't want it coming to light. There is always a witch-hunt after events like this and they needed a suitable scapegoat. What better sideshow than creating a fuss about something absurd that will occupy the attention of a few obsessives and make the idea of questioning any aspect of 9/11 ridiculous? It will go nowhere, and after a few years of fruitless navel-gazing people will get bored of the whole subject and move on. And that's exactly what has happened.

After all, what possible sense would there be to rig explosives in the towers in the first place? You already saw two planes crashing into skyscrapers. That's enough, in propaganda terms, and anything else is just gilding the lily.

This is just a wild guess but without the body count caused by the buildings coming down they might not have been able to justify going to war and that's what they really, REALLY wanted to do. It's amazing to me that all these uber reasonable people never bother to ask cui bono anymore.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century

[Jackstar]

What's your next questionn?

Didn't any of you ever watch Columbo?!

Marrry me!

[Jackstar]

I put 9/11 conspiracy theories in the same basket as the majority of UFO sightings.

Yes, but you're demonstrably insipid.

[Jackstar]

Building 7 had no people in it when it later collapsed

It sure had a shitload of evidence about the Teapot Dome scandal Enron investigation, though, didn't it?

Your intellectual dishonesty is repugnant. I hope you get ass cancer in your head and die in a fire.

after a massive fire.

What evidence can you produce of this 'massive' fire? I double dog dare you mother f*****, say "what?" one more time.

[whoozit]

Why does any thread Jackstar posts in devolve into a WTC 7 discussion?  He could turn a thread about the tooth fairy into a WTC 7 discussion.  Why don't you fucking start a WTC 7 thread (if you already haven't started one or seven of them already) and keep it all there?  Is that too much to ask?

[Jackstar]

Is that too much to ask?

SUBJECT: "***BREAKING*** Explosion in NYC"


My nigga, I am posting on topic. Check your privilege.

[whoozit]

SUBJECT: "***BREAKING*** Explosion in NYC"


My nigga, I am posting on topic. Check your privilege.

I think you are following the letter of the thread and not the spirit.  Thank you for not asking me who killed Kennedy.  My privilege is fine, it's yours that is swollen.

[Jackstar]

I think you are following the letter of the thread and not the spirit.

What does that even mean?

[Jackstar]

What evidence can you produce of this 'massive' fire?

#Brangelina

[Jackstar]

Duh, the floors falling successively onto each other.

Duh.

Is that a greater diameter than you'd expect?

How do you expect gravity to explain this lateral movement?

Seems about what I'd expect, based on lots of experience long ago w building blocks.

I don't find your experience compelling.

[Robert]

How do you expect gravity to explain this lateral movement?

When I drop small, irregularly shaped objects on the hard floor, they bounce sideways distances that seem implausible.

[Jackstar]

How do you expect to be taken seriously?

[Jackstar]

they bounce sideways distances that seem implausible.

What does one have to drop to get pyroclastic-like clouds of particularized debris?