Impeachment, yes or no

[yumyumtree]

I once thought that impeaching Obama would be a disastrous move for Republicans because the standards are high( high crimes and misdemeanors) and anyway who wants Slow Joe for pres? And the last time Republicans tried to impeach a president, things didnt turn out too well. But now a lot of people whose intellect I respect, such as Sarah Palin and Mark Levin( I know that I call him Screaming Mimi but I still respect his intellect) are down with impeachment. So how about it?

[onan]

I once thought that impeaching Obama would be a disastrous move for Republicans because the standards are high( high crimes and misdemeanors) and anyway who wants Slow Joe for pres? And the last time Republicans tried to impeach a president, things didnt turn out too well. But now a lot of people whose intellect I respect, such as Sarah Palin and Mark Levin( I know that I call him Screaming Mimi but I still respect his intellect) are down with impeachment. So how about it?

Yes by all means, I think the republicans are so far up their own ass they couldn't make a right decision if they tried. Levin and Palin don't give a rat shit about anything except audience share. Yes by all means go for an impeachment... fucking brilliant.

[albrecht]

I once thought that impeaching Obama would be a disastrous move for Republicans because the standards are high( high crimes and misdemeanors) and anyway who wants Slow Joe for pres? And the last time Republicans tried to impeach a president, things didnt turn out too well. But now a lot of people whose intellect I respect, such as Sarah Palin and Mark Levin( I know that I call him Screaming Mimi but I still respect his intellect) are down with impeachment. So how about it?

He deserves it (but so did quite a few of our recent Presidents) but it would be a bad move. Better to focus on stopping his actions and electing people in State legislatures and House and Senate. And resisting his policies wherever possible. Impeachment would be a debacle and waste of time.

[Catsmile]

OMG!

So long, and thanks for the laughs.
Before I go, the answer is 42.

[RealCool Daddio]

... a lot of people whose intellect I respect, such as Sarah Palin ...

This is...just.....

Wow.

My sarcasm circuits are completely overloading at this ridiculously golden opportunity for a response.

[Juan]

Yeah, go ahead losers. Then maybe we'd be rid of the Repukes.

[albrecht]

Yeah, go ahead losers. Then maybe we'd be rid of the Repukes.

Exactly. I'm guessing Obama is loving this idea of impeachment. Anything to take away focus from the real issues and his performance and decisions.

[Gd5150]

And the last time Republicans tried to impeach a president, things didnt turn out too well.

Actually they were successful and Clinton was impeached and disbarred. As for successfully removing someone from office and destroying their legacy, that can't happen unless you control the media and education system which means that can only happen to Republicans. Ie Richard Nixon.

Watergate is an absolute joke compared to things modern Presidents are doing. "The War Room" celebrated stealing secrets from their opponents and using them to win the '92 presidential election and of course the media and education system celebrates it.

The Republiclowns in office now would never have the balls to take on president Obortion or the media. Would be a waste of time anyways, they'd never succeed and even if they did he'd be made a martyr for racism blah blah blah. He's checked out, let him play golf and party with Jay-Z. We can wait 3 years to fix the mess he's made of the economy, medical system, and foreign policy.

[onan]

Exactly. I'm guessing Obama is loving this idea of impeachment. Anything to take away focus from the real issues and his performance and decisions.

And had you guys been working on building an inclusive party, you wouldn't be in the mess you are in. Face it, your party, as attractive as it is to you, more people reject it.

[pyewacket]

I think the two party system is broken beyond repair. They all should wear Nascar suits so we can see who owns them. I'd rather see people from all walks of life band together by finding common issues that they care about and work together. As long as everyone hates/fights each other NOTHING will change and we'll keep getting more of the same from both sets of crooks.

[albrecht]

And had you guys been working on building an inclusive party, you wouldn't be in the mess you are in. Face it, your party, as attractive as it is to you, more people reject it.

Sure, though it isn't my party, I understand your theory. LCD is always the easiest way and promising "free stuff" and "saving the planet" also will sell, particularly with an open-border and uneducated population. I have never doubted that the theories and marketing ideas of the various leftists aren't popular, or effective in attracting votes. Aside from fear-based political marketing (usually used by the more rightist parties but now embraced by the left with the "global warming", "climate change", "climate disruption") the promise of "free stuff" and "blame the rich" work very well as a get out the vote campaign. Now whether the policies work is another question. But there is always, at least until total collapse, some people or companies to blame when they don't.

[West of the Rockies]

YumYum, I think Palin and other pundits are looking only to increase their bank accounts, notoriety, and audience shares by saying outrageous things to fire up the base.  Perhaps this was true of those who called for W's impeachment as well.  Zero sum politics... Not so good.

[onan]

Sure, though it isn't my party, I understand your theory. LCD is always the easiest way and promising "free stuff" and "saving the planet" also will sell, particularly with an open-border and uneducated population. I have never doubted that the theories and marketing ideas of the various leftists aren't popular, or effective in attracting votes. Aside from fear-based political marketing (usually used by the more rightist parties but now embraced by the left with the "global warming", "climate change", "climate disruption") the promise of "free stuff" and "blame the rich" work very well as a get out the vote campaign. Now whether the policies work is another question. But there is always, at least until total collapse, some people or companies to blame when they don't.

I hope your talking points keep you secure.

If you want to be honest you will belly up to the bar and realize both parties have lots of areas to be held in contempt.

But global (whatever doesn't annoy you) is real and it is getting worse.

Your class warfare is for the most part just bullshit. When the US had the most robust economy the wealthiest were taxed in the 90 percentile. And our country was booming. We did great things, we aspired to even greater things. We respected science and weren't afraid to admit lots of people were much smarter than us.

Now we have presidential candidates that are willing to state they believe in the literal translation of the bible. Raise their hands and denounce evolution. Call the president they disagree with, a liar and pillory those that denounce the president they do like.

I have made it clear I am not a big fan of Obama, I was at the beginning of his first term. I think as much as I dislike some of his positions, he is better for the diminishing middle class and poor than Mitt could ever have been.

[albrecht]

Your class warfare is for the most part just bullshit. When the US had the most robust economy the wealthiest were taxed in the 90 percentile. And our country was booming. We did great things, we aspired to even greater things. We respected science and weren't afraid to admit lots of people were much smarter than us.

I hear you on that. We also had tariffs and a legitimate immigration scheme and quotas in those times. I actually think, though in practice it is hard, that the 'death tax' should be 100%. That would be real "level playing field" certain people like to talk about. If there was some way to partition vast financial fortunes, versus things like small farms or family businesses. And that won't happen. The "American System" was the best deal and although I don't like some of the banking details the system worked amazingly well and looked after the country, and its people, first.

Obama is no friend of the middle-class by the way. Traditionally it is the middle-classes that are the danger because it prevents the uprising of the worker. The bourgeois middle-class keeps the hierarchy in place because although not a real part of it they support the idea of private property and capital ownership. No change, or "fundamental transformation," can occur while they still are a significant part of the population.

[onan]

I hear you on that. We also had tariffs and a legitimate immigration scheme and quotas in those times. I actually think, though in practice it is hard, that the 'death tax' should be 100%. That would be real "level playing field" certain people like to talk about. If there was some way to partition vast financial fortunes, versus things like small farms or family businesses. And that won't happen. The "American System" was the best deal and although I don't like some of the banking details the system worked amazingly well and looked after the country, and its people, first.

Obama is no friend of the middle-class by the way. Traditionally it is the middle-classes that are the danger because it prevents the uprising of the worker. The bourgeois middle-class keeps the hierarchy in place because although not a real part of it they support the idea of private property and capital ownership. No change, or "fundamental transformation," can occur while they still are a significant part of the population.

I actually would like to see wealth of over 2 million dollars in an estate be used to continue the business it more than likely originated from. I am not fond of large amounts of estates just handed to any government.

I agree Obama is not the friend I had thought he would be to the middle class. I just think Mitt would have been worse.

[albrecht]

I actually would like to see wealth of over 2 million dollars in an estate be used to continue the business it more than likely originated from. I am not fond of large amounts of estates just handed to any government.

I agree Obama is not the friend I had thought he would be to the middle class. I just think Mitt would have been worse.

I know that they sometimes do good things but there should also be some kind of law (if I were King haha) about financial manipulations related to Foundations and charitable trusts. Too often they are just a way to hide wealth, beat taxes, employ neer-do-well family, and fund pet causes to the detriment of the public good. Why should a billionaire be able to direct where their money goes but not me? I would like to be able to pick-and-choose where my tax money goes also. Off to a game. Later...

[Quick Karl]

He deserves it (but so did quite a few of our recent Presidents) but it would be a bad move. Better to focus on stopping his actions and electing people in State legislatures and House and Senate. And resisting his policies wherever possible. Impeachment would be a debacle and waste of time.

Agree.

The cock sucking traitor deserves to be impeached, but it would be better to own State Legislatures and the House and Senate, and destroy him and his fucked-up Anti-American political agenda that way.

[Quick Karl]

And had you guys been working on building an inclusive party, you wouldn't be in the mess you are in. Face it, your party, as attractive as it is to you, more people reject it.

If "your party" wasn't in such a panic, Obama would not be DOING things to provoke impeachment -- which the demunists are counting on, so they can waive the racism flag in a hail-marry effort to stop the coming tidal wave of votes FOR AMERICA and against demunism.

[onan]

If "your party" wasn't in such a panic, Obama would not be DOING things to provoke impeachment -- which the demunists are counting on, so they can waive the racism flag in a hail-marry effort to stop the coming tidal wave of votes FOR AMERICA and against demunism.

Little inside info for you, not gonna be impeached.

[Quick Karl]

I agree Obama is not the friend I had thought he would be to the middle class. I just think Mitt would have been worse.

CNN Poll: Americans really wish they had elected Mitt Romney instead of Obama http://theweek.com/article/index/265418/speedreads-americans-really-wish-they-elected-mitt-romney-instead-of-obama

[onan]

CNN Poll: Americans really wish they had elected Mitt Romney instead of Obama http://theweek.com/article/index/265418/speedreads-americans-really-wish-they-elected-mitt-romney-instead-of-obama

Yeah, ok.

[Quick Karl]

Little inside info for you, not gonna be impeached.

That's what I just said, albeit abstractly - try reading it again...

[onan]

That's what I just said, albeit abstractly - try reading it again...

Quite honestly QK, I have given up all but skimming your posts. Whether it is your intent or just your passion/anger... it comes off as someone ranting.

[Quick Karl]

Quite honestly QK, I have given up all but skimming your posts. Whether it is your intent or just your passion/anger... it comes off as someone ranting.

Wait, did I hurt your feelings?

[b_dubb]

No

[onan]

Wait, did I hurt your feelings?

No, man. I was being honest with you. Really trying to be respectful. And with you that is difficult.

[RealCool Daddio]

It's endlessly amusing how all these so called patriots and constitutionalists endlessly call for impeachment, yet don't understand that there is no constitutional or legal grounds for impeachment.  Could it be that the have neither read or understood the document they hold so dear?

Article II, Section IV reads:

The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.

So, what are the grounds for impeachment, exactly?

[PB the Deplorable]

... If you want to be honest you will belly up to the bar and realize both parties have lots of areas to be held in contempt...

Now we're getting somewhere

... Now we have presidential candidates that are willing to state they believe in the literal translation of the bible. Raise their hands and denounce evolution...

I hear this sort of anti-religiousness from the Liberals all the time.  I'm not a Christian, or even religious or 'spiritual', but I really do not understand why people's Biblical beliefs, when they conflict with science, are seen as a threat.  I mean, so what?

Governing on the national level is about foreign policy, new spending programs, funding levels of existing programs, new taxes, increasing or decreasing rates on existing taxes, that sort of thing.  Like it or not, abortion is settled law.  What difference does it make if someone thinks we descended from apes or thinks we didn't?  Or thinks the Earth is 6000 years old or several billion?  It doesn't really come into play up on Capital Hill.  And the same goes for state and local office.

To me this is just another way to discredit certain Conservatives, make them look stupid, and get more Liberals elected.  Funny thing though - the policies supported by the Conservatives - religious or otherwise - have a better track record than the failed policies of the Libs, no matter how smart they are said to be.

... Call the president they disagree with, a liar and pillory those that denounce the president they do like...

Well, Obama is a liar.  It's really all he does.  He hasn't told the truth about anything yet.  Let me know if you want to se the list again.

But let me suggest that if the Libs hadn't trashed Reagan and many in his Administration, hadn't trashed Bush, hadn't run that disgusting racist campaign against Clarence Thomas, and the one against Robert Bork, hadn't spent 30 years insisting the R's are racist, Nazi's, and all the rest, Obama would not be getting the treatment he's gotten. 

The Conservatives as a whole are better people than the Liberals.  We believe in what this country was founded on and they are just here for the handouts.  We are tolerant - regardless of what they claim, they are the intolerant.  Until this destructive America hater Obama and his toadies were placed in the White House, the Conservatives and Republicans for the most part did not respond to the lies, smears, and name calling in kind.  That was a mistake.  I personally think the Right should act the same way the Left has been acting all these years - and even more so - until they decide to call a truce and be civil.

[b_dubb]

PB needs to lay off the KoolAid

There hasn't been a Conservative President since ... Lincoln?  Theodore Roosevelt was a "Trust Buster". Reagan and Bushes 1 & 2 spent us into oblivion. Every Republican Admin has compounded the deficit.

The Democrats are slightly less shitty. Clinton left office with a surplus. Which Bush Jr promised to give away. And it's been downhill ever since.

[PB the Deplorable]

It's endlessly amusing how all these so called patriots and constitutionalists endlessly call for impeachment, yet don't understand that there is no constitutional or legal grounds for impeachment.  Could it be that the have neither read or understood the document they hold so dear?

Article II, Section IV reads:

The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.

So, what are the grounds for impeachment, exactly?

By 'high crimes and misdemeanors' the founders meant the conduct of the President, and to a lesser extent - incompetence.  Impeachment (and the trial to convict in the Senate) is a political act.  It's a mistake to equate it to a regular criminal matter taken up by a court.

This President has ignored court decisions, has taken action beyond his powers as President, ignores laws he has sworn to uphold, has illegally made unilateral changes to other laws.  He has used the IRS against his opponents, and has created a massive surveillance program to spy on US citizens that have neither committed any crime nor are suspected of doing so.  His EPA is out of control writing new regulations that are either not supported by any underlying law or are the opposite of the intent of existing law.  He has created senior policy making positions (the 'czars') and made appointments without Senate confirmation - which was illegal, as all senior policy makers are required to be confirmed.  He has undercut our allies and emboldened our enemies.  He is hollowing out our military to the point we are under WWI era strength as far as naval vessels, and 'shooters' in the army.   He issues Executive Orders in areas beyond his authority as President, and claims Executive Privilege, not to protect national security, but to cover up illegal activities in his administration.  Not only the IRS but the EPA have destroyed subpoenaed documents, and have sent employees to Congress to under oath.  Other Administration members subpoenaed by Congress have refused to testify.

Any single item above is an Impeachable act.  The volume taken as a whole is breathtaking.