Hillary Clinton

[PB the Deplorable]

The "tapes" are ridiculously lame attempt to villainize a lawyer for doing what lawyer do...

Somewhat.  I'd argue that's what scumbag lawyers do.

Either which way, the problem is the deceit and the reveling in a grotesque outcome.  How old was that rape victim again?

[VtaGeezer]

Somewhat.  I'd argue that's what scumbag lawyers do.

Either which way, the problem is the deceit and the reveling in a grotesque outcome.  How old was that rape victim again?

So by your definition, criminal defense lawyers who insist convictions are based on legal evidence are scum bags. What the hell, we don't need rights, just good conservative prosecutors and judges, eh? 

[onan]

So by your definition, criminal defense lawyers who insist convictions are based on legal evidence are scum bags. What the hell, we don't need rights, just good conservative prosecutors and judges, eh?

I agree with you. Everyone deserves an ethical defense. If the police and prosecution screwed up... it sucks. Especially when we can all the see what is right. But if we let the back door be the benchmark, well slippery slope and all that.

[Quick Karl]

I would rather look like Glenn Close than the steaming pile of crap your parents abandoned.

This is what passes for mature intellect in nitwits world!

[NowhereInTime]

This is what passes for mature intellect in nitwits world!

This is what passes when you accept the lowest common denominator.

[Quick Karl]

This is what passes when you accept the lowest common denominator.

We know that about you.

[PB the Deplorable]

So by your definition, criminal defense lawyers who insist convictions are based on legal evidence are scum bags. What the hell, we don't need rights, just good conservative prosecutors and judges, eh?

First off, what about the main point of the post - and of the tape - that Hilary was deceitful, and gleeful in her 'victory' - a result she knew was BS?  Is that really a quality we want in our public officials?  Or is it ok if they have a (D) after their name?


And by the way, the rights we have to a fair trial are not supposed to be used to get guilty people off.  They are there for the innocent who has been incorrectly charged, not to benefit the perp.  To be at the point we are today where instead of a fact finding mission, it's a game that gives all the rights to the criminal - and it's considered just fine for the defense to be as sleazy and unethical as they need to be to get their client off - is disgusting.  And just another plank in the Democrat Party Platform.

And yes, the same goes for sleazy win-at-all-cost prosecutors.

[Quick Karl]

First off, what about the main point of the post - and of the tape - that Hilary was deceitful, and gleeful in her 'victory' - a result she knew was BS?  Is that really a quality we want in our public officials?  Or is it ok if they have a (D) after their name?


And by the way, the rights we have to a fair trial are not supposed to be used to get guilty people off.  They are there for the innocent who has been incorrectly charged, not to benefit the perp.  To be at the point we are today where instead of a fact finding mission, it's a game that gives all the rights to the criminal - and it's considered just fine for the defense to be as sleazy and unethical as they need to be to get their client off - is disgusting.  And just another plank in the Democrat Party Platform.

And yes, the same goes for sleazy win-at-all-cost prosecutors.

Harvard and Yale Law Schools, and every other Institute of Higher CorruptionLearning in the America, do not teach Justice, they teach how to win, REGARDLESS of Justice - and in some twisted teacher's empty head, that EQUALS Justice.

[albrecht]

I agree with you. Everyone deserves an ethical defense. If the police and prosecution screwed up... it sucks. Especially when we can all the see what is right. But if we let the back door be the benchmark, well slippery slope and all that.

As I mentioned even the pedophile rapist deserves a vigorous defense by his counsel. However:
1) the lawyer needs not volunteer. She claimed she did it as a "favor" for the prosecutor (likely assuming a future quid-pro-quo would follow I imagine if I know Arkansas and the Clintons of that time.) But even if no future "favors" would be granted, she did not need to take the case. (Once taken, I agree, she was vigorous in her work and that is what lawyers should do.)

2) Even IF forced onto the case, like with a pro-bono or public defender work by firm or courts, which is NOT the case here and the lawyer gets the pedophile rapist off (or as in this case a lesser charge) she shouldn't break his confidentiality by giving interviews of his guilt or anything about communications, lie-detectors, etc with him (he is now "not guilty" and that is a violation of privilege/confidentiality unless he gave consent to do so).

3) Lastly it is at least in bad taste- considering the victim- to laugh and brag about getting him off (in the legal sense, not as he did with the poor girl especially when knowing/thinking that they guy was guilty! And then still to laugh and brag.

[Quick Karl]

As I mentioned even the pedophile rapist deserves a vigorous defense by his counsel. However:
1) the lawyer needs not volunteer. She claimed she did it as a "favor" for the prosecutor (likely assuming a future quid-pro-quo would follow I imagine if I know Arkansas and the Clintons of that time.) But even if no future "favors" would be granted, she did not need to take the case. (Once taken, I agree, she was vigorous in her work and that is what lawyers should do.)

2) Even IF forced onto the case, like with a pro-bono or public defender work by firm or courts, which is NOT the case here and the lawyer gets the pedophile rapist off (or as in this case a lesser charge) she shouldn't break his confidentiality by giving interviews of his guilt or anything about communications, lie-detectors, etc with him (he is now "not guilty" and that is a violation of privilege/confidentiality unless he gave consent to do so).

3) Lastly it is at least in bad taste- considering the victim- to laugh and brag about getting him off (in the legal sense, not as he did with the poor girl especially when knowing/thinking that they guy was guilty! And then still to laugh and brag.

It would be terrible if a male lawyer did this - but I have no fucking clue how a woman lawyer could do it, then laugh about it.

[albrecht]

It would be terrible if a male lawyer did this - but I have no fucking clue how a woman lawyer could do it, then laugh about it.

As as it had been said for millennia they are the most deadly of the species. And, I suspect, in the Clinton species most especially so.

[Quick Karl]

As as it had been said for millennia they are the most deadly of the species. And, I suspect, in the Clinton species most especially so.

Probably what I really meant is that I have no clue how anyone can HEAR or READ that a woman layer did it, and LAUGHED about it, and still support her, for anything...

[Yorkshire pud]

Probably what I really meant is that I have no clue how anyone can HEAR or READ that a woman layer did it, and LAUGHED about it, and still support her, for anything...

It could be worse. Someone could read your shite and still support you.

[Quick Karl]

It could be worse. Someone could read your shite and still support you.

If my private messages are any clue, lots of people do.

[Yorkshire pud]

If my private messages are any clue, lots of people do.

Of course they do. Other than your fellow sociopath near Seattle though, who else would possibly admit to supporting you? I have many many more forum posters (A few of their identities might surprise you-they did me) telling me differently. 

[Quick Karl]

... their identities might surprise you-they did me

You HAVE to be a 14-yr old girl.

It's getting boring to bait you anymore.

[Yorkshire pud]

You HAVE to be a 14-yr old girl.

It's getting boring to bait you anymore.

If you knew I was 14, you'd have tried to come onto me by now. Asked me for my phone number, my facebook ID, and probably get me to send you photos.

As I'm not, you haven't.

[Quick Karl]

If you knew I was 14, you'd have tried to come onto me by now. Asked me for my phone number, my facebook ID, and probably get me to send you photos.

As I'm not, you haven't.

I never though it was possible for any human on the planet to be as needy as you; you are so desperate for attention it is mind-numbing.

[Yorkshire pud]

I never though it was possible for any human on the planet to be as needy as you; you are so desperate for attention it is mind-numbing.

I just love it that you can't resist feeding that 'need'. Go on...see if you can.

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[SciFiAuthor]

I'm not going to rehash the questionable content of the recording, Karl and Paper have done that that already. But I'm going to reiterate something that Albrecht initially pointed out: Hillary's accent changes. My Senator, Claire McCaskill does the same, she pronounces the state "Missouri" when she's here and speaking like us, and then says "Missourah" when she wants to look folky, down to earth and "Heartlandish" to the east and west coasters. Let me dispel a myth, no one here fucking says "Missourah". It has an I at the end, English language folks, pronounce it as an I. Look, I write fiction and you present accents to create a character for a narrative to play into pop-cultural misconceptions and lead people along and ensnare them in your narrative. It doesn't matter if the narrative is a novel or a political campaign, what matters is that how you speak or write influences people. For me it's to try to make the words jump from the page and create a page turner, but in politics it's to try to get people to vote for you based on how your words come across. Fuck that, it's still fiction and an attempt to lead you along.

Hillary's a sleazy fucking lawyer looking for power. That's it. And how sleazy money grubbing lawyers turned politicians present themselves is absolutely meaningless in the big picture. They're simply ambitious sleaze. The Democrats need to quit falling for this shit. Question these fucking people until you're blue in the face. Don't fall for the narratives; question. You're all failing badly at that. In the GOP, we aren't. Karl questions, Albrecht questions, Paper questions, I question, we all question, and you silly fucking Dems don't. Quit it already, will ya?

[Yorkshire pud]

I'm not going to rehash the questionable content of the recording, Karl and Paper have done that that already. But I'm going to reiterate something that Albrecht initially pointed out: Hillary's accent changes. Look, I write fiction and you present accents to create a character for a narrative. It doesn't matter if the narrative is a novel or a political campaign, what matters is that how you speak or write influences people. For me it's to try to make the words jump from the page and create a page turner, but in politics it's to try to get people to vote for you based on how your words come across. Fuck that, it's still fiction and an attempt to lead you along.

Really? One day voice coaching will become an occupation that politicians use...one day.

Hillary's a sleazy fucking lawyer looking for power. That's it. And how sleazy money grubbing lawyers turned politicians present themselves is absolutely meaningless in the big picture. They're simply ambitious sleaze. The Democrats need to quit falling for this shit. Question these fucking people until you're blue in the face. Don't fall for the narratives, question. You're all failing badly at that. In the GOP, we aren't. Karl questions, Albrecht questions it, Paper questions, I question, we all question, and you silly fucking Dems don't. Quit it already, will ya?

What is there to question? Politicians and the truth are not natural bed fellows? Get outta here!!!  :

[SciFiAuthor]

Really? One day voice coaching will become an occupation that politicians use...one day.

They already do. Look, George VI needed voice coaching. A famous movie was made about it. Talking, or writing, to people can be quantified to something akin to a model. You can get better at it if you follow certain rules. If you think prominent journalists and politicians are speaking straight to you, then, well, you're just falling for a gag. You fall for it all the time.

What is there to question? Politicians and the truth are not natural bed fellows? Get outta here!!!  :

I think everyone knows that politicians lie, but when it comes to identifying the lies it becomes a question of knowingly defending the lies of one's political affiliation. That's what we do, it's what you do right in front of me.

[onan]

I think everyone knows that politicians lie, but when it comes to identifying the lies it becomes a question of knowingly defending the lies of one's political affiliation. That's what we do, it's what you do right in front of me.

That happens on both sides of the fence, every day, every hour, and so on, so on, so forth.

And not many of us are all that good at remaining skeptical. And some that do remain skeptical do so at their own peril. It may well be impossible for us, biologically speaking, to find a true balance in skepticism.

[Yorkshire pud]

They already do. Look, George VI needed voice coaching. A famous movie was made about it. Talking, or writing, to people can be quantified to something akin to a model. You can get better at it if you follow certain rules. If you think prominent journalists and politicians are speaking straight to you, then, well, you're just falling for a gag. You fall for it all the time.

I can't speak for anyone else but I'll let you into a secret: I've never ever believed a politician of any persuasion spoke to me. And guess what; I know that politicians have had voice coaching for many years. George VI needed it because of a speech impediment, not because he was trying to persuade people to vote for him, or rather more importantly, backers to put money into the campaign.

I think everyone knows that politicians lie, but when it comes to identifying the lies it becomes a question of knowingly defending the lies of one's political affiliation. That's what we do, it's what you do right in front of me.

I don't accept the word of any politician as anything but acting. Results I can accept.. I can also accept the intentions being good and bad. I accept that some politicians work damned hard for their constituents, and it goes unsaid but every screw up is reported-that goes with the territory. Serious political journos say on occasion that ours get a bad press (irony) and the vast majority do work hard and for the good of the population.
I've said before, but few have really impressed me. Mo Mowlem, John Smith, Churchill, Tony Benn (who impressed my for his intelligence and integrity, not his politics)..Blair I could willingly see banged up on Alcatraz for the rest of his miserable life. 

[PB the Deplorable]

... Blair I could willingly see banged up on Alcatraz for the rest of his miserable life.

As a... tourist guide?

[Yorkshire pud]

As a... tourist guide?

Only if it was permitted to drag him around the island under water on the end of a rope around his ankles.

Not that I have any strong feelings about the odious smug fucking bastard.

[albrecht]

I'm not going to rehash the questionable content of the recording, Karl and Paper have done that that already. But I'm going to reiterate something that Albrecht initially pointed out: Hillary's accent changes. My Senator, Claire McCaskill does the same,

Not quite as bad same phenomena but you will notice Rick Perry on recent interviews is definitely sounding less Texan- another funny one I've seen was Hillary when speaking to some black group and she suddenly shifts into some kind of black Southern accent that was really amazing.

Maybe, as David Icke and various callers have said, politicians really are some kind of shape-shifting creatures!? They certainly can switch their political positions and accents when it suits them.

[WildCard]

If you had any doubt, for better or worse, Hillary is running.

Responding to a "quiz" from Stewart, she says she'd like to work from home in room without corners.

The final question - "Do you enjoy constant, non-stop criticism?"

Proceed.

[analog kid]

I could tell she's running because she's been chiming in on every topical news item with her irritating presidential tone. She has it down to an art form, except she's pretty much a soulless husk of a person at this point. I'm so beyond sick of the woman.

[Quick Karl]

I could tell she's running because she's been chiming in on every topical news item with her irritating presidential tone. She has it down to an art form, except she's pretty much a soulless husk of a person at this point. I'm so beyond sick of the woman.

You're just a racist.

Oh, wait...