Socialist thread

[someguy]

Hey everyone! Here is a thread for anyone socialist, or anyone leaning that way. How about we work together and unionize? We're the people who build the roads. We're the people who pick up your garbage. We're the people who serve you hamburgers. We're the people who fix your shitty toilet. We're the people who change the oil in your BMW. Hell yeah!


The Preacher and the Slave - Joe Hill


Flogging Molly - The Power's Out with Lyrics

[Yorkshire pud]

Hey everyone! Here is a thread for anyone socialist, or anyone leaning that way. How about we work together and unionize? We're the people who build the roads. We're the people who pick up your garbage. We're the people who serve you hamburgers. We're the people who fix your shitty toilet. We're the people who change the oil in your BMW. Hell yeah!

You know the origins of unions don't you? You're correct in one respect by implying they were borne of the men doing the shitty (mainly very hard manual) jobs. However these days pilots have unions. Doctors and nurses have unions. The guy changing your BMW oil might have no association with any union or socialism.

As for socialism itself; it's true philosophy has been in many ways diluted, plagiarised and in many ways forgotten by those who claim to be socialists, or those who claim others are socialists. The term 'champagne' socialist came out of the 80's in the UK; essentially aimed at those who claim to be so, but really don't want to be associated with it's origins and true philosophy..I guess an analogy might be animal farm and equality.

You can have union members who are socialist or not. Margaret Thatcher didn't get elected in 1979 on a landslide exclusively by non union members! 

[someguy]

You know the origins of unions don't you? You're correct in one respect by implying they were borne of the men doing the shitty (mainly very hard manual) jobs. However these days pilots have unions. Doctors and nurses have unions. The guy changing your BMW oil might have no association with any union or socialism.

As for socialism itself; it's true philosophy has been in many ways diluted, plagiarised and in many ways forgotten by those who claim to be socialists, or those who claim others are socialists. The term 'champagne' socialist came out of the 80's in the UK; essentially aimed at those who claim to be so, but really don't want to be associated with it's origins and true philosophy..I guess an analogy might be animal farm and equality.

You can have union members who are socialist or not. Margaret Thatcher didn't get elected in 1979 on a landslide exclusively by non union members!

It's quite sad isn't it? The people actively working against their own interests. Doctors and nurses should have a union, and pilots should have a union just like bus drivers. Socialism and Unions have become dirty words these days.


Union Democracy

[onan]

It's quite sad isn't it? The people actively working against their own interests. Doctors and nurses should have a union, and pilots should have a union just like bus drivers. Socialism and Unions have become dirty words these days.


Union Democracy

Yeah, they have. And it is always about the corruption. But corruption takes many forms. I will always remember the history of the Homestead Strike and the Battle of Blue Mountain. If I am going to be corrupted it will be for the impoverished and exploited.

[someguy]

Yeah, they have. And it is always about the corruption. But corruption takes many forms. I will always remember the history of the Homestead Strike and the Battle of Blue Mountain. If I am going to be corrupted it will be for the impoverished and exploited.

It really worked out well how they divided everyone. You have people being exploited, yet they'll still talk about the "job creators" and bitch about stuff like occupy wall street and unions. Then they'll break their ass while being underpaid for a necessary job. And that's not to mention the young people who don't know that you're allowed to tell your boss no when you're asked to do dangerous things.


Solidarity Forever (Pete Seeger)

[Partiefiuchter]

Union is a very  scary word to Walmart managers & staff, though common to folks overseas in the NATO states it's something they actively work against elsewhere, all the while they profit from the 3rd world and grow to be the leading employer of U.S. citizens.


Yoshi's Island: Subliminal Soviet Propaganda?

It really worked out well how they divided everyone. You have people being exploited, yet they'll still talk about the "job creators" and bitch about stuff like occupy wall street and unions. Then they'll break their ass while being underpaid for a necessary job. And that's not to mention the young people who don't know that you're allowed to tell your boss no when you're asked to do dangerous things.


Solidarity Forever (Pete Seeger)

Shake Hands with Danger (1970)

[tertiaryimam]

Can fascists join this thread?

Or rugged individualists?

Or plain ol' anti-socialists?

[DanTSX]

Oh boy!  A thread for perpetual undergrads! :

Because if communism didn't work, communism light HAS to work.  If only the damn free market types didn't keep sabotaging it.


P.S.  My plumber and BMW mechanic are capitalists.  They make a ton of money given their limited education.  Especially my plumber.  And are not anchored down with some stupid shop mentality that might had worked back in the 1800's before the union slobs were given the ability to come to work drunk without fear of reprisal provided they were voting the right way each contract.

Merry Christmas and all, but you mentally stunted retards are idealistic at best.  I know I know, I'm just holding up the table for The Koch Borthers and Bain Crapital right?  It can't be that I just want to get the best out of life for me and my family and build something for myself?  Nope.  My existence must be limited so that I can pull the wagon for a bunch of loafers that make shitty choices and want into my pockets.  Merry Christmas but Fuck you.

[DanTSX]

Can fascists join this thread?

Or rugged individualists?

Or plain ol' anti-socialists?

Bearded, homosexual, duck hunter, islamofaschists are especially welcome.

Especially if they are ching-chong-chinese

[DanTSX]

WE ARE THE NINETY NINE PERCENT MITT ROMNEY MADE US THIS WAY!!! HE CONTROLS MY LIFE.  SARAH PALIN KILLS ABORTION DOCTORS.  BOOO HOOO

[Juan]

I was a member of the musician's union, the American Federation of Musicians, for a long time.  I served several terms on our local's board of directors and was an active, pro-union person.  Then the janitors went on strike at the union's headquarters, and the AFofM officials crossed the picket lines.  A couple of years later, our little symphony was selected to premiere a work, and our members were supplemented by some big city players.  With union approval, the big city players got their higher scale, while we got a much lower scale.

At that point, I realized the problem was not political systems, unions, governments or corporations, but the people who got their hands on power.  People.

[DanTSX]

I was a member of the musician's union, the American Federation of Musicians, for a long time.  I served several terms on our local's board of directors and was an active, pro-union person.  Then the janitors went on strike at the union's headquarters, and the AFofM officials crossed the picket lines.  A couple of years later, our little symphony was selected to premiere a work, and our members were supplemented by some big city players.  With union approval, the big city players got their higher scale, while we got a much lower scale.

At that point, I realized the problem was not political systems, unions, governments or corporations, but the people who got their hands on power.  People.

Which is true about socialism in general.

The control freaks are control freaks and you can't do shit about it once they are in short of going Syria on them.  Same as the old boss, but with less options and less oversight.  Just a "trust" in a "system" and the leaders.


Note I have very little issue with the concept of unions.  But not when they are used as a covert, coopted political means.  They have begun to act in their management's interest rather than their members.  No better than factory management at that point.    The working man / tradesman gets fucked again.  Don't trust these schmucks

[DanTSX]

Union is a very  scary word to Walmart managers & staff, though common to folks overseas in the NATO states it's something they actively work against elsewhere, all the while they profit from the 3rd world and grow to be the leading employer of U.S. citizens.


Yoshi's Island: Subliminal Soviet Propaganda?


Shake Hands with Danger (1970)

Oh they were forced to work at wal mart in shitty dangerous conditions?


If wal mart had trouble finding people who wanted those jobs, they would raise wages to meet demand.

[tertiaryimam]

I'm fascinated that Justin Bieber decided to quit at this point in his career. He's only 19 and has a lot of potential. It seems premature. Honestly, I don't think he will stay quitted for long. Likely he'll take a few years off to find himself --- probably spend some time in a Buddhist monastery --- and he'll come back better than ever.

Anyway, Justin, if you're reading this remember that we all go through tough times, but Albert Einstein said, "What doesn't kill me makes me stronger." I think you'll weather this rough patch in your life and move on to better things very soon.

[onan]

Oh boy!  A thread for perpetual undergrads! :

Because if communism didn't work, communism light HAS to work.  If only the damn free market types didn't keep sabotaging it.


P.S.  My plumber and BMW mechanic are capitalists.  They make a ton of money given their limited education.  Especially my plumber.  And are not anchored down with some stupid shop mentality that might had worked back in the 1800's before the union slobs were given the ability to come to work drunk without fear of reprisal provided they were voting the right way each contract.

Merry Christmas and all, but you mentally stunted retards are idealistic at best.  I know I know, I'm just holding up the table for The Koch Borthers and Bain Crapital right?  It can't be that I just want to get the best out of life for me and my family and build something for myself?  Nope.  My existence must be limited so that I can pull the wagon for a bunch of loafers that make shitty choices and want into my pockets.  Merry Christmas but Fuck you.

The only shitty choice I have made today is to read your post and respond to it.

[PB the Deplorable]

I'm not sure union membership equates to socialism.  Trade union organizer Lech Walesa and Solidarity played the major role in the downfall of Poland's Soviet aligned government.

Doesn't it seem strange that the further Left a government is, the less likely independent unions are allowed?  There were no free trade unions in the USSR or the East Bloc, none in places like Cuba, N. Korea, China.  Just phony government controlled ones, if that.


For the US in 2012, 7.3 million public sector employees belonged to a union, and 7.0 million private sector employees belonged to a union.  The union membership rate in the public sector workers was 35.9%, and for private sector workers it was 6.6%.  6.6%!  Are private sector unions dying out?  Did union demands play a part in our factories being shut down and our jobs exported?


http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/union2.pdf

It seemed strange to me working conditions in the public sector were so bad it required union representation.  Then I realized the reason public employees are unionized is so unions can deliver voting blocs to the highest bidder.  It's a corrupt rip off of the taxpayers, who have no say in public sector union contracts but end up picking up the tab.

[somatichypermutation]

Unions are not socialism, they are the free market balancing the rights of workers against those of big business.

Universal healthcare is not socialism, it is governments caring for the people who support it.

What is the problem with WalMart?  My problem is not what they charge or how they treat their workers, my problem is that they pay so little at places like WalMart and McDonalds that we as a society are expected to pay section 8 housing, welfare, food stamps, and other government benefits to these workers whether we choose to shop there or not.  That is the issue, and that is why we need a living wage so that the costs at WalMart to their customers reflect their total cost to society.  We are essentially providing these large companies welfare, and it is inappropriate.

[PB the Deplorable]

Do you have anything more up to date?  This is dated 1911 in the fine print at the bottom, and we must have learned something about Socialism since then. 

The USSR and Mao's China have come and gone.  We've had an industrial revolution, globalized, modernized, and now are now in the age of information and communication.  We've had 2 world wars and a cold war.

[DanTSX]

The only shitty choice I have made today is to read your post and respond to it.

Truth hurts

[DanTSX]

Every socialist is replaceable

Not every capitalist is replaceable

have fun

[onan]

Every socialist is replaceable

Not every capitalist is replaceable

have fun

Your tenet is nonsensical. the Jesus many follow was much more socialist than capitalist... I am not sure replaceable is true.

The truth doesn't have to hurt. Rambling conjecture with the intent to diminish or insult is rather tedious, which in all candor represents most of your posts.

[aldousburbank]

The primeval christian apostolic cult, heavily persecuted and extremely marginalized, was one of the few examples that we have of functional socialism with any amount of human dignity, IMO. That, and my family.

[DanTSX]

The primeval christian apostolic cult, heavily persecuted and extremely marginalized, was one of the few examples that we have of functional socialism with any amount of human dignity, IMO. That, and my family.

Perhaps it works ok on a small scale. 

But not on anything larger than local cults.

[DanTSX]

Your tenet is nonsensical. the Jesus many follow was much more socialist than capitalist... I am not sure replaceable is true.

The truth doesn't have to hurt. Rambling conjecture with the intent to diminish or insult is rather tedious, which in all candor represents most of your posts.

Socialism doesn't scale up to nations well at all.

Truth hurts.  My candor is the truth

[aldousburbank]

Perhaps it works ok on a small scale. 

But not on anything larger than local cults.

Holy shit! I totally agree!  Merry Christmas dude!

[DanTSX]

Holy shit! I totally agree!  Merry Christmas dude!

Same to you Aldous!

[Quick Karl]

I said it on "that other" thread, but I will say it again - Merry Christmas to all y'all.

Other than that, it is sad that people can be so easily divided into little political, social, and philosophical cliques, and led to believe complete fairytales, to support the power-mad agenda of their chosen cult's rotten lying RICH leaders. A factual chart of the richest in the Congress and Senate would make lots of people shit-their-pants.

In the History of the World, what system has provided the most opportunity for any person to lift themselves out of the shear poverty and subjugation that has been the experience of people for 99% of history?

And then, what systems have produced to MOST poor folks and embarked on mass murders on scales incomprehensible to people that refuse to think and be fair in their conclusions?

No, the Representative Republic that America was conceived as, has never, and will never, be perfect - keep in mind that we are NOT living under those tenants today - we are living under an intentional distortion of Representative Republicanism.

So fuck off.

Love,

QK

[FightTheFuture]

The problem with socialism is, you eventually run out of other people's money.

I believe we are now witnessing that problem manifest itself today in the United States of America, which is without question, a quasi-socialist country.

[somatichypermutation]

Dan TSX-

Have any facts to share just uneducated right wing lies and other assorted bullshit.  Mother fucker.

[Quick Karl]

Dan TSX-

Have any facts to share just uneducated right wing lies and other assorted bullshit.  Mother fucker.

You can have this one, Dan. I'm just going to relax and watch the pummeling...