Steve Warner's Dark City

[Bart Ell]

Jazmunda keeps sending "audition photos" to be the spokesmodel. It's gotten kind of embarrassing really.

I think those are just the pics he sends to everyone...

[bateman]

Oh and in regards to the weather satellite contrail video. That's actually quite revealing, because it rules out a space plane. 8000 MPH is not enough to achieve orbit, as the Rand document claims that specific aircraft did. Assuming that the space plane needs to be as close to the ground for observation as possible, it would need to attain LEO speeds, i.e. around 17,500 MPH, basically the speed of the typical Space Shuttle mission. Plus, if you saw a space plane from orbit, its speed would be increasing to reach orbit. This one was apparently constant at 8000 MPH is far too slow for space, meaning that it had to be an aircraft within the atmosphere. Again, this suggests that two secret aircraft exist instead of one.

I've posted it elsewhere on here, but I saw an arrowhead shaped thing over Manchester England about 7 years ago. Sunny day and I was lying on my back in a park, watching the planes approaching Manchester airport with a few at high altitude on the usual routes. I noticed a dark shaped plane at least twice the altitude of the usual traffic. Moving east to west. It covered the sky in a few seconds with the same contrail described in the video.

There's an anecdote Chuck Clark recounted in Phil Patton's Dreamland book where he talked about climbing up to the top of one of the mountain ranges surrounding Area 51 (this was before the Dept. of the Interior bought it all up) and seeing a black aircraft taxiing out onto the runway, and as soon as the wheels lifted off, the lights just disappeared, the thing was gone in seconds. He claims to have video of this, but won't release it until they declassify whatever it is.

[cweb]

I should note too that we didn't just lose the capability of the SR-71, but also the capability of the space shuttle. A lot of people don't realize it, but the shuttles were used regularly in espionage in the 80's. It may simply be that the Aurora replaces the SR-71 and Blackstar was developed to replace the shuttle after the Challenger accident threatened to shut the shuttles down.

I don't remember if it was posted earlier in this thread or the Jet Thread, but it was pointed out that the cargo bay on the space shuttle was specifically designed so that it could, "if needed," fit a KH-9 Hexagon spy satellite. Considering that technology has allowed satellites to get smaller and more capable over the years, who knows what kind of goodies went up with the astronauts.

Not to sound too Hoagland-ish here, but I'd wonder what other types of non-satellite spy craft are currently deployed to space. Paul Hellyer has mentioned such things in his interviews, and there was an Art Bell guest (Officer X) who suggested there may be a second Mir space station. Of course, this could all be disinformation too...

[bateman]

I don't remember if it was posted earlier in this thread or the Jet Thread, but it was pointed out that the cargo bay on the space shuttle was specifically designed so that it could, "if needed," fit a KH-9 Hexagon spy satellite. Considering that technology has allowed satellites to get smaller and more capable over the years, who knows what kind of goodies went up with the astronauts.

Not to sound too Hoagland-ish here, but I'd wonder what other types of non-satellite spy craft are currently deployed to space. Paul Hellyer has mentioned such things in his interviews, and there was an Art Bell guest (Officer X) who suggested there may be a second Mir space station. Of course, this could all be disinformation too...

X-37B is very likely one of them.



http://www.space.com/11025-x37b-space-plane-air-force-secret-mission.html

http://www.space.com/25611-x37b-military-space-plane-500-days.html

[b_dubb]

JP Muclestones will cradle your junk with the same care as a mother nursing a new born

Dark Weekend rules!!

[SciFiAuthor]

I don't remember if it was posted earlier in this thread or the Jet Thread, but it was pointed out that the cargo bay on the space shuttle was specifically designed so that it could, "if needed," fit a KH-9 Hexagon spy satellite. Considering that technology has allowed satellites to get smaller and more capable over the years, who knows what kind of goodies went up with the astronauts.

Not to sound too Hoagland-ish here, but I'd wonder what other types of non-satellite spy craft are currently deployed to space. Paul Hellyer has mentioned such things in his interviews, and there was an Art Bell guest (Officer X) who suggested there may be a second Mir space station. Of course, this could all be disinformation too...

As Bateman points out, the X-37B is definitely operational. But it's really more of a test bed or catch all type of thing to replace the loss of the shuttle's practical capabilities when they were retired. The Air Force has adopted an independence policy from NASA, so we really do have two space programs going at this stage, so I have no doubt that the USAF (and other countries) have other classified craft for use in space.

X-37B is usually chalked up as something to use for spying, which can be done of course, but it's more important for use in servicing spy satellites and as a technology test bed for the USAF. I do know that there is a manned derivative, X-37C, in development (or was in 2011) at Boeing. Ostensibly it's supposed to compete as a commercial vehicle, but all of a sudden Boeing quit talking much about it. That can mean it's defunct for whatever reason, but it can also mean that the USAF wants the vehicle and has classified its development.

The problem with the rumors about the second MIR and other things is that they would be visible to the satellite watchers and amateur astronomers. The first X-37B was discovered and tracked almost immediately by amateurs. They even directly photographed it:

http://www.universetoday.com/87005/spying-on-spy-satellites-with-thierry-legault/

Why they have not similarly photographed Blackstar makes me wonder if 1. the program is no longer active. 2. they've developed visual orbital stealth capability using non-reflective surface materials 3. the flights are rare and expensive. 

[Uncle Duke]

Still enjoying your show Bateman. There's actually enough out there now to prove that the government acted on your reasoning regarding the loss of the SR-71's capabilities. A document was declassified around 2006 originating from the Rand corporation in the 90's that describes the successes and failures of a test of a space plane specifically as a replacement for the capabilities of the SR-71. They knew there was a hole in capability. The report states that two of the planes failed to reach orbit, however the third was successful. Apparently development continued on how to stealth these aircraft, so where this program is now is anyone's guess. Presumably it's the rumored aircraft called "Blackstar" colloquially, but it could also be "Aurora".

Both might also be the same plane, but the discrepancy between the knotted contrails (PDE engine) and more standard contrails (something else) suggests that we had two secret aircraft that replaced the SR-71 in development. Also the British MOD has declassified a report suggesting that UAP sightings in their coastal airspace could partly be explained by the SR-71, and two redacted most likely American aircraft.

It's in the data, Jorch, just look at the data.

Another interesting piece of this puzzle could be the National Aerospace Plane or NASP. This was the aircraft Reagan referred to as the space "Orient Express".  NASP was what is sometimes called a "gray program" in the aerospace business, meaning it's a project that is openly acknowledged but very close hold in terms of information released to the public. NASP started out as a joint black DoD/NASA program in the early 80s before Reagan announced its existence during his second term. 

No NASP aircraft ever flew, or at least was never acknowledged as having flown, but the program made significant R&D strides, particularly aero-structures.  Clearly any advances made during NASP could have been applied to Blackstar or other similar air vehicles.  NASP folded just about the time the rumors/sightings of strange, ultra-high performance aircraft began to draw attention in the aviation, then mainstream, press.  Some have speculated NASP was never anymore than a program of convenience to allow white world funding of black world technologies. When it outlived its usefulness for that purpose, it was dropped.

[SciFiAuthor]

Another interesting piece of this puzzle could be the National Aerospace Plane or NASP. This was the aircraft Reagan referred to as the space "Orient Express".  NASP was what is sometimes called a "gray program" in the aerospace business, meaning it's a project that is openly acknowledged but very close hold in terms of information released to the public. NASP started out as a joint black DoD/NASA program in the early 80s before Reagan announced its existence during his second term. 

No NASP aircraft ever flew, or at least was never acknowledged as having flown, but the program made significant R&D strides, particularly aero-structures.  Clearly any advances made during NASP could have been applied to Blackstar or other similar air vehicles.  NASP folded just about the time the rumors/sightings of strange, ultra-high performance aircraft began to draw attention in the aviation, then mainstream, press.  Some have speculated NASP was never anymore than a program of convenience to allow white world funding of black world technologies. When it outlived its usefulness for that purpose, it was dropped.

I think you hit the nail on the head that NASP was just a convenience fund for a military aircraft. They knew at the time from Concorde that supersonic (or orbital) passenger transport would simply be too expensive for most people to make use of. Reagan knew that the Soviets would spend money on copying western civilian aircraft advances, Tu-144 being a glaring example, and the policy at the time was to get the Soviets to spend themselves into bankruptcy. So they went public with it. With the fall, it was no longer advantageous to keep it as a grey project and it went back to being black.

That's my bet on how it went down, anyway. And with the Rand document, we know that at least one successful space plane was built.

[Uncle Duke]

I think you hit the nail on the head that NASP was just a convenience fund for a military aircraft. They knew at the time from Concorde that supersonic (or orbital) passenger transport would simply be too expensive for most people to make use of. Reagan knew that the Soviets would spend money on copying western civilian aircraft advances, Tu-144 being a glaring example, and the policy at the time was to get the Soviets to spend themselves into bankruptcy. So they went public with it. With the fall, it was no longer advantageous to keep it as a grey project and it went back to being black.



That's my bet on how it went down, anyway. And with the Rand document, we know that at least one successful space plane was built.

Technologies went back to the black, but NASP as an air vehicle definitely folded its tent when the program was cancelled in the early 90s.  Also, I think the idea was the Soviets would spend countless rubles trying to defend against/defeat a space plane weapon system as opposed to copying it.  Considering the Russians' inability to even work with titanium and their reliance on vacuum tube technology well into the 80s, they wouldn't have had a prayer of building or copying a space plane at the time. Even their Space Shuttle clone, Buran, was never a viable reusable manned space craft.

I have never read the Rand or MoD reports you referenced, but would like to do so.  Any idea where I can find them on-line?  Back a few months ago, Jimmy Church had Nick Pope as a guest.  At my request Jimmy asked him if specific UK UFO sightings had been recognized by the MoD/RAF as US black aircraft, and if he personally had been read in, or at least defensively briefed, on those aircraft.  He comfirmed the former, but talked around the latter.  He also acknowledged Chris Gibson's North Sea oil platform sighting in 1989, but again wouldn't confirm he knew what that aircraft was.

[Gemstone]

JP Muclestones will cradle your junk with the same care as a mother nursing a new born

Dark Weekend rules!!

Dark Weekend completely rules!
I've been J.P.Mucklestoned
. . .You've got to feel this fabric!

[Mind Flayer Monk]

Considering the Russians' inability to even work with titanium and their

I'm surprised to hear this. I thought 80% of the world's titanium sponge came from Russia (the USSR at that time).

[Uncle Duke]

I'm surprised to hear this. I thought 80% of the world's titanium sponge came from Russia (the USSR at that time).

Remember we're talking late 70's/early 80's.  When Belenko defected to Japan in his MiG-25, one of the biggest surprises was the Soviets' use of stainless steel for the wings and fuselage.  The a/c needed its large wing area because of its weight.  I'm neither a structures nor a manufacturing guy, but I think the problem the Russians had with titanium was welding it.  Don't know their current capabilities with titanium.

[Yorkshire pud]

Remember we're talking late 70's/early 80's.  When Belenko defected to Japan in his MiG-25, one of the biggest surprises was the Soviets' use of stainless steel for the wings and fuselage.  The a/c needed its large wing area because of its weight.  I'm neither a structures nor a manufacturing guy, but I think the problem the Russians had with titanium was welding it.  Don't know their current capabilities with titanium.

The Mig 25 was also at one point the second fastest aircraft in the world..It was capable of nearly Mach 3 and capable of something like 80000 feet. However; if it did, the engines had to be replaced as they were wrecked. Much mirth was made in the west about the captured one in Japan having valves in its boards rather than transistors and early chips. Until it was pointed out it would be impervious to EMP in the event of a nuclear attack.

[Juan]

Valves (tubes to you Yankee dullards) are impervious to EMP?  I've got boxes and boxes of those things.

[Yorkshire pud]

Valves (tubes to you Yankee dullards) are impervious to EMP?  I've got boxes and boxes of those things.

You can start building a shelter with them and relax in the knowledge they won't be taken out as you try and contact the outside wasteland from within.

[Spinner]

I want my dose of "Dark Weekend"!

[Mind Flayer Monk]

You can start building a shelter with them and relax in the knowledge they won't be taken out as you try and contact the outside wasteland from within.

Oh yeah. Just like Dr. Bloodmoney.



Where is our new Dark Weekend episode?

[Spinner]

No Dark Weekend...? 
I guess I missed an important announcement. That's what I get for minding my real life instead of checking the latest forum posts every five minutes (as I know I should).

Bateman, What's going on?

[bateman]

No Dark Weekend...? 
I guess I missed an important announcement. That's what I get for minding my real life instead of checking the latest forum posts every five minutes (as I know I should).

Bateman, What's going on?

Minding my real life is what I was doing too, unfortunately. My great grandmother died (104) so I was dealing with some family stuff, plus MUFON Symposium was this past weekend. Couple new shows are coming.

[Spinner]

Minding my real life is what I was doing too, unfortunately. My great grandmother died (104) so I was dealing with some family stuff, plus MUFON Symposium was this past weekend. Couple new shows are coming.

I'm so sorry to hear about your great grandmother.104, Wow! I hope her last days were peaceful and surrounded by her loved ones. I knew there had to be a very important reason for you to miss a show.

Looking forward to the new shows!

[ziznak]

Looking forward to the new shows!

me tew
How are yewwww?

[Bart Ell]

Got sweaty balls waiting for the next Dark Weekend?
J.P.Mucklestone to the rescue!

[popple]

Dark Weekend completely rules!
I've been J.P.Mucklestoned
. . .You've got to feel this fabric!

The first undies I've ever wanted to snuggle, & I think I've developed slight separation anxiety.

[bateman]

New show tonight: alien abduction regression with Craig Lang, hypnotherapist & MUFON Field Investigation Coordinator.

[Bart Ell]

New show tonight: alien abduction regression with Craig Lang, hypnotherapist & MUFON Field Investigation Coordinator.

Now that's how you do it.

[Spinner]

Ah, boom boom bah!
Thanks!   

[bateman]

Podcast is up: https://soundcloud.com/dark-weekend/hypnotherapist-craig-lang-on-et-abduction

and the website has been updated: www.darkweekend.com

[midnight]

Ah, boom boom bah!
Thanks!   

Thanks x 2!
Excited for another show!

[cweb]

Very nice!

Any plans on creating a "guest archive" on the website? Or listing the bumper music? (It's one thing that I actually like about C2C.) You've got the best bumpers in the 'biz, sir.

[PrairieGhost]

Bateman, what's the chance of you going 3 hours? You know you want to do it!