Obama's speech on syria

[williedee]

All I can say is that this was one of the strangest presidential speeches I've heard. Definitely didn't sway me towards his side that's for sure. Good luck Obama.

[Sardondi]

All I can say is that this was one of the strangest presidential speeches I've heard. Definitely didn't sway me towards his side that's for sure. Good luck Obama.

Peggy Noonan agrees with you: http://blogs.wsj.com/peggynoonan/2013/09/10/making-sense-of-syria/

[ItsOver]

All I can say is that this was one of the strangest presidential speeches I've heard. Definitely didn't sway me towards his side that's for sure. Good luck Obama.

All I can say is that this is one of the strangest administrations I've ever witnessed.  I can't believe this character is in the WH.  Good luck America.

[coaster]

The speech was pointless. He looked defeated, and stumbled over his words. I changed the channel.

[Foodlion]

  Makes you wonder what is going on inside his head.

[Sardondi]

It's all about appearances anyway. Obama's actually thrilled to have Putin's blatantly fraudulent offer of taking control of Assad's weaponized gas. Obama knows as well as his entire intel and military apparatus that there's no way such a takeover can be accomplished in a year, even if Putin would be in the least inclined to follow up on such a ludicrous suggestion and Assad likewise motivated to give up one of his major weapons. But Putin is an adult playing a grownup's game, and he can see the flop sweat all over Little Barry, who is juts praying to Gaia for someone to please save him. And in one of history's most cynical deals, Putin will offer what he never intends to do, and Obama will accept what he knows will never be done, and both will pretend that the Emperor's New Clothes are the most magnificent ever seen in the kingdom. Because that way Barry O can lecture the rubes on how he really showed ol' Assad this time, yesirree Bob. 

[PB the Deplorable]

He'd already committed to a live speech on National TV.  It was to drum up support for the war, but Putin and Assad undercut him with the deal to turn over the chemical weapons.

He should have just canceled the speech.  Instead he decided to prove he is weak and incompetent instead of just having people wonder about it.

[Yorkshire pud]

The Putin proposal if it came to pass in entirety would be a fantastic thing; however it has so many facets that all of them being pulled off successfully the generous might say, is wishful thinking at best and impossible in reality.

1)The weapons themselves; if Assad has the weapons as alleged, can Russia be sure he's aware he has the full inventory? How do they (and the USA and France) satisfy themselves that the list they're given is comprehensive and current?

2) How can anyone be sure that they're in a safe environment now? Are they stable? Will inspection and audit be too dangerous?

3) Removal; where to? By whom? How secure can it be made?

4) Confirmation; Can all parties be sure everything has been removed? (Short answer I think has to be no)

5) 1-4 has to be done in the context that the ongoing civil war won't be put on hold, no time out. Anyone want to take any guesses on the life expectancy of an inspector in that scenario?

Meantime, non chemical weapons have killed and are still killing civilians every day. I see no signs that is going to change any time soon.


This is what Mark Mardell had to say. It isn't really complimentary although some of the comments beneath support Obama.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24044008

[Tinfoil Hat]

The speech didn't convince me either. I wish Mr Obama was half as concerned about the average American as he is for the Syrians. He needs to deal with things here in the good ol' U.S. of A first and foremost before engaging in any international adventures.

[Ruteger]

Hey, anyone hear the story of a little child being dismembered ALIVE with a band-saw by Hussein's friends in the rebel army? GOOGLE it. These are the maniacs HUSSEIN obama is supporting in Syria. Oh, and let's not forget the video of the rebel guy that cut the heart out of a syrian soldier and ate it.

[coaster]

Hey, anyone hear the story of a little child being dismembered ALIVE with a band-saw by Hussein's friends in the rebel army? GOOGLE it.

Um..no thanks. I'll take your word for it.

[b_dubb]

lets call Oates and see what he makes of O's speech

[Yorkshire pud]

Hey, anyone hear the story of a little child being dismembered ALIVE with a band-saw by Hussein's friends in the rebel army? GOOGLE it. These are the maniacs HUSSEIN obama is supporting in Syria. Oh, and let's not forget the video of the rebel guy that cut the heart out of a syrian soldier and ate it.

Typical; the grown ups are having a reasonably measured chat and the needy kid with the runny nose has to stand between them...run and play.

Incidentally, if you google "Two suns" you'll find loads of videos from arseholes who think lens flare is the evidence of two suns. Similarly if you google Vietnam war, you'll find napalm was used, and children were inexcusably killed there too. But why let debate get in the way of sensationalist and heavily biased cherry picking? And before you pick up that little baton and run with it; no, it isn't excusing deplorable war crimes.

[b_dubb]

Hey, anyone hear the story of a little child being dismembered ALIVE with a band-saw by Hussein's friends in the rebel army? GOOGLE it. These are the maniacs HUSSEIN obama is supporting in Syria. Oh, and let's not forget the video of the rebel guy that cut the heart out of a syrian soldier and ate it.

You're an idiot and a douchebag

[Yorkshire pud]

You had to flatter him with his good points didn't you?

You're an idiot and a douchebag

[West of the Rockies]

I'd like to see some of the conservative voices here chastize Ruteger.  Sure, maybe it's not their wish or job to counsel one of their own; maybe they don't want to "speak ill of another conservative".  Maybe a Sardondi would say, "Hey, R is no conservative; he's a knucklehead."  But Ruteger is perceived as being a rightwinger by everyone here.  And he's not helping push forward whatever is the conservative agenda today.

I am clearly one of the lefties here; if/when I see a lefty say something inane (yeah, it happens), I will try to challenge it and suggest stronger critical thinking efforts. 

Just a thought.  Now tell me to fuck off.

[The General]

Boy, it's a sad day in America when our leaders make Vladimir Putin look like an advocate of democracy and diplomacy.

[Sardondi]

I'd like to see some of the conservative voices here chastize Ruteger.  Sure, maybe it's not their wish or job to counsel one of their own; maybe they don't want to "speak ill of another conservative".  Maybe a Sardondi would say, "Hey, R is no conservative; he's a knucklehead."  But Ruteger is perceived as being a rightwinger by everyone here.  And he's not helping push forward whatever is the conservative agenda today.

I am clearly one of the lefties here; if/when I see a lefty say something inane (yeah, it happens), I will try to challenge it and suggest stronger critical thinking efforts. 

Just a thought.  Now tell me to fuck off.

Let me see if I get this: you get to choose the teams we want to play with? I don't think so. Besides, I'm having trouble recalling your calldowns of your allies. But I can recall one of mine of the guy you're so eager to chain me to: http://coastgab.com/index.php?topic=4338.msg121762#msg121762 And he's still closer to correct than you a lot of the time.

Now, as you requested to be told, fuck off.

Boy, it's a sad day in America when our leaders make Vladimir Putin look like an advocate of democracy and diplomacy

And no one at the NYT sees any irony in the former KGB chief lecturing America on what its vital interests are? This is the kind of humiliation we must be put to when we have a grossly incompetent, puffed-up man as President, who has made himself a world-class laughingstock. But I don't understand why the NYT felt like it had to provide the mike for the stand-up routine. More evidence of the fact our media feels loyal to some kind of fuzzy international conglomeration rather than the Unites States of America.

[The General]

...This is the kind of humiliation we must be put to when we have a grossly incompetent, puffed-up man as President, who has made himself a world-class laughingstock...

If anyone wondered who would win in a game of global chess, I think the former KGB man has our guy outsmarted.  Obama's last known jobs before entering into politics were junior college professor and 'community organizer.' He's not exactly presidential material, and is WAY out of his league.  I do hope that we will vet our candidates more closely in the future, but I doubt we will.

Obama was sold to the American electorate as though he were a refreshing can of soda.

[Juan]

But I don't understand why the NYT felt like it had to provide the mike for the stand-up routine. M

They're desperately trying to raise their circulation, and thus their ad rates.

[Sardondi]

They're desperately trying to raise their circulation, and thus their ad rates.

*self -administered dope slap*

[PB the Deplorable]

Hey, anyone hear the story of a little child being dismembered ALIVE with a band-saw by Hussein's friends in the rebel army? GOOGLE it. These are the maniacs HUSSEIN obama is supporting in Syria. Oh, and let's not forget the video of the rebel guy that cut the heart out of a syrian soldier and ate it.

I'd like to see some of the conservative voices here chastize Ruteger...

Which part needs chastisement?

The news coming out of the Syrian Christian city of Maalaula since it was overrun and captured by the 'rebels' several days ago has been beyond sickening.  Including the incidents Ruteger mentioned, and worse if that's possible. This has been going on all along in other parts of Syria.  Most of the 'rebels' are the so-called 'foreign fighters' aligned with al-Qaeda and not Syrians at all, and they have been committing atrocities daily.  Against Christians, Ismailis, Druze, Shiites (Alawites), anyone else they come across they don't like or don't think is devout enough.  In my opinion, they are very likely the ones that used the poison gas in an attempt to draw Obama in after he issued his Red Line statement. 

The term maniacs?  I'd say that's giving them the benefit of the doubt. 

That they are Obama's friends?  He's supported the Sunni terrorists taking over governments in Libya, and Egypt.  Waiting until they stole the revolutions from the people before stepping in.  He's trying to do the same now in Syria.  He helped push out our ally Saleh in Yemen.  At some point it becomes a trend instead of a series of blunders.   Now that the terrorists have stolen the Syrian revolution, he is supplying them with weapons, supporting them with diplomatic efforts, and was planning on attacking military targets they provided - and still may. 

That Ruteger is insulting the President by calling him by his middle name Hussein?  The President deserves nothing but scorn and disrespect at this point - and not just for this.  He needs to resign.

[Yorkshire pud]

Which part needs chastisement?

Oh dear; Do you seriously think (and really think carefully) that Obama directly supports what Rutwhatsit has suggested to google? Any more than Nixon supported Mia lai? In that instance up to (the actual numbers are not known) 500 civilians were murdered by American troops. Abu Ghraib prison? Was Bush actively supportive of that? Korea? Or more up to date; what about the depleted uranium and phosphorous bomb attacks in Iraq that have resulted in catastrophic birth defects and injuries.. The general who ordered that a personal friend of Bush or Cheney? What of the Apache heli crew who murdered the civvies and gave a running commentary? Closer to home (yours); children killed by 'maniacs' who have legitimate<sic> access to firearms. Do you know that more Americans have been killed on home turf with guns since 1776 than all wars they've been involved in, combined? Does a child being murdered by a Glock or a AR15 in Texas die any less than a child in Syria at the hands of another sort of maniac?? The trouble and inconvenience with shooting accusations is that when the finger is pointed, frequently the three pointing right back at you are ignored, because it's better not to look in that mirror.

[PB the Deplorable]

Oh dear; Do you seriously think (and really think carefully) that Obama directly supports what Rutwhatsit has suggested to google?...

He didn't say Obama supported it.  He referenced reports coming out of Syria, and said these are some of the people Obama is supporting there (i,e, 'friends'). 

Completely accurate.

[PB the Deplorable]

... Closer to home (yours); children killed by 'maniacs' who have legitimate<sic> access to firearms. Do you know that more Americans have been killed on home turf with guns since 1776 than all wars they've been involved in, combined? Does a child being murdered by a Glock or a AR15 in Texas die any less than a child in Syria at the hands of another sort of maniac??...

Yes, the US military is very efficient.  Yes, our inner cities are filled with a bunch of vile violent thugs.  Apples and oranges.  I'm not sure why you connected the two in a thread about Syria


You've been told before that the gun violence statistics overwhelmingly come out of our inner cites and this has nothing at all to do with responsible gun owners.  In our country, people have a right to defend themselves and make their own decisions.  So far.

As far as the problems of our inner city - these places are corrupt one-party fiefdoms run by the same kind of political machines that people like Obama come from.  The sensible people in this country are not involved in governing these places or making policy. 

When it comes up, and we suggest issues like handouts that encourage single parent families, dependency, driving business  (and jobs) out of town, more and tougher policing, and giving control of the schools back to the parents and teachers instead of the teachers unions and politicians, we are told we are racists and to shut up. 

The most misguided of the D's - the Progressives - own the inner cities and their problems 100%.  There is nothing the rest of us can do about it.  But we aren't giving up our right to self protection because of crime and failure in the inner city.

Hopefully you'll wait another couple of weeks before bringing this up again.

[Yorkshire pud]

Yes, the US military is very efficient.  Yes, our inner cities are filled with a bunch of vile violent thugs.  Apples and oranges.  I'm not sure why you connected the two in a thread about Syria

As you say; apples and oranges, one you feel is perpetuated by violent thugs and the other, erm, presumably violent thugs? The US military is very efficient? Is that the euphemism for being a war criminal? It's connected to Syria, for the simple reason that Rut and you appear to take only one aspect of murder and disregard others that are uncomfortable; as I said, finger pointing..

You've been told before that the gun violence statistics overwhelmingly come out of our inner cites and this has nothing at all to do with responsible gun owners. 

And the atrocities in Syria (or the war zone of your choice) are not representative of the overwhelming civilian victims in the whole sorry mess; but again, with you and Rut, the mention of Muslim and you're good to go with invective and incontextual all encompassing ignorance. I don't want to invoke Godwins law, but not all Germans were Nazis, and neither were all Nazis German (including Hitler).

[Nucky Nolan]

They're desperately trying to raise their circulation, and thus their ad rates.

It's sad that a man, with links to the KGB, wrote it. It's great to live in a place where frightening alphabet agencies don't spy on citizens' every move.

[Nucky Nolan]

Hey, anyone hear the story of a little child being dismembered ALIVE with a band-saw by Hussein's friends in the rebel army? GOOGLE it. These are the maniacs HUSSEIN obama is supporting in Syria. Oh, and let's not forget the video of the rebel guy that cut the heart out of a syrian soldier and ate it.

Except for "Hussein's friends", there's nothing wrong with this post. It tells the truth, which can be a revolutionary act. The rebels murder and torture all kinds of people, especially Christians, but you don't hear *much* about that from the War Party, which blurs both Demoblican and Repubocrat lines. They indeed are the ones who the War Party wishes to help, so forgive me if I'm not outraged by this post.

[PB the Deplorable]

... the mention of Muslim and you're good to go with invective...

Just calling 'em as I see 'em. 

Awhile back I saw a quick survey someone did of the, at the time, 26 wars going on around he world.  22 involved Muslims on one or both sides.  Mostly as the aggressors.

As an exercise, take a look at a map of the world.  Circle the Muslim areas - from West Africa and North Africa, across the middle east, down the eastern coast of Africa, up to Chechnya, across central Asia to Pakistan, circle places like Bangladesh and parts of eastern Burma, down through Indonesia, Malaysia, and the southern parts of Thailand and the Philippines. 

Then go back over the map of the world and place and X on all the trouble areas.  Then you tell me who it is that can't get along with their neighbors.


And we're not even including places in the West that are experiencing all sorts of problems when they come here. 

Look at their economies, their society - especially their wretched societies - arts, education, government.  Face it, for the most part they are uncivilized people stuck in the 7th century.  This is not a group that has a religion separate from the rest of the way they operate in society - it is all encompassing unlike anything we are familiar with in the West.  No amount of insisting is going to change that.

I do understand the desire to feel good about one's self defending minorities and the downtrodden, being considered PC and all that.  But not at the expense of the truth.



One thing that fascinates me is when the people who nominally claim the Moslems are mostly just like the rest of us really want to insult Christians or whoever - they compare them to Moslems.

[PB the Deplorable]

Except for "Hussein's friends", there's nothing wrong with this post. It tells the truth, which can be a revolutionary act. The rebels murder and torture all kinds of people, especially Christians, but you don't hear *much* about that from the War Party, which blurs both Demoblican and Repubocrat lines. They indeed are the ones who the War Party wishes to help, so forgive me if I'm not outraged by this post.

It's true this time it isn't just the Obama Administration. 

Unlike with Libya, Egypt, etc, he intentionally wanted to get members of the House and Senate on record as supporting this.  So he wouldn't be alone when it's finally revealed to all who it is he is supporting in Syria.  So far, it's mainly just Obama (and his administration), the leaders of his party that felt obligated to go along with him, John McCain and some of his cronies.  Not a huge group.

For Obama I think it's about ideology.  For the others it's about PAC money and politics.