Random Political Thoughts

[PB the Deplorable]

... So, are the Thai and Ukrainian protesters leftists?

Not everything is Left or Right.

For example 'Nationalism' is neither Left nor Right.  Famous Nationalists include George Washington, The Dalai Lama, Mao, Gandhi, Hitler, Ho Chi Minh, De Gaulle, Nelson Mandela, etc. 

Ukraines wanting to look West and have closer ties with Europe, and consequently less ties with Russia, are not necessarily Left nor Right. 

The business class (which include the military, the police, government employees, and an enormous number of people that own tiny businesses in the larger cities and especially Bangkok) in Thailand wanting a different government than the one representing the poor and rural electorate (and that they see as corrupt) is also not necessarily Left nor Right.

[Yorkshire pud]

No.  As I said, the quotes I attributed to Obama were things he said. 

Not the ones I marked 'The Public'

So it's effectively bullshit? And has no value other than your fevered rantings?

[Yorkshire pud]

Not everything is Left or Right.

For example 'Nationalism' is neither Left nor Right.  Famous Nationalists include George Washington, The Dalai Lama, Mao, Gandhi, Hitler, Ho Chi Minh, De Gaulle, Nelson Mandela, etc. 

Ukraines wanting to look West and have closer ties with Europe, and consequently less ties with Russia, are not necessarily Left nor Right. 

The business class (which include the military, the police, government employees, and an enormous number of people that own tiny businesses in the larger cities and especially Bangkok) in Thailand wanting a different government than the one representing the poor and rural electorate (and that they see as corrupt) is also not necessarily Left nor Right.

Ha ha! But the ones who protest against capitalist largess in the USA and Europe are Marxist?

[PB the Deplorable]

Ha ha! But the ones who protest against capitalist largess in the USA and Europe are Marxist?

There can be nationalism on both the left and right.  Their economic theories are what make them Marxist, or whatever

[PB the Deplorable]

So it's effectively bullshit? And has no value other than your fevered rantings?

It was for anyone who wondered what the hell he meant by all those odd comments.

[Lunger]

So it's effectively bullshit? And has no value other than your fevered rantings?

No.  Obama is a Marxist!



And, a piece of shit.

[NowhereInTime]

No.  Obama is a Marxist!



And, a piece of shit.

You're a nitwit and, evidenced by your avatar, a pussy.

[PB the Deplorable]

No.  Obama is a Marxist!

And, a piece of shit.

But not in that order

The other day Obama said he wants to host Sports Center when he retires.  I guess he'd be ok as long as the tele-prompter was working, but do we really need a compulsive liar giving us the sports scores?

[West of the Rockies]

How do you guys feel about the weird intersection of religion and politics?  I just read that the courts will not force the parents of an 11-year-old Amish girl to get chemotherapy for her leukemia.  Evidently, their religion prevents them from seeking such treatment for their daughter.  I wonder if this minor child understands -- truly comprehends -- the consequences of this decision (this assumes she is of the same opinion as her parents). 

Are her rights being violated?  What if she did want treatment; would she be able to receive it despite her parents' religious objections?  We hear about how religious belief can prevent death -- such as in the case of abortion where a woman would not abort a fetus because of her religious perspective.  Is this a case where religious belief may actually lead to death?  Of course, chemotherapy is not a guarantee of health, but still, one wonders. 

It's a strange world we live in....

[West of the Rockies]

Man, here was this thread chugging along at 71 pages and I managed to totally kill it! 

[aldousburbank]

Thank you!

[West of the Rockies]

Regarding this thread (in the voice of Hannibal Lecter):  "Best thing for him really... his therapy was going nowhere."

[PB the Deplorable]

Hope I'm not overly politicizing the thread, but it is curious to me how people identify themselves and each other with those terms conservative, liberal, etc.  We hear about "Blue Dog Democrats" (Dems who are perceived by other Dems as being too moderate or even right-leaning).  We hear about RINO's (Republicans in Name Only -- they lean to far to the center or left according to those further to the right). 

We really seem to absolutely shutter these days at the thought of compromise, that "the other side" might have a bit of wisdom or a few good ideas.  It's all lock-step my-way-or-the-highway nowadays.  Scorched-Earth politics are catastrophic to a healthy political climate.

WotR, you posted this on the Annoyed thread but I thought I'd answer it here.

It's more difficult when one party decides to start calling the other party 'racist' and 'Nazi's'.  When their election strategies revolve around telling old people the other party is going to steal their Social Security and want to poison the air and water. 

When the 'Progressives' took over that party, they upped the ante and said the WHOLE country is racist, from the slave owning Founding Fathers on.

It was all well and good - well, except for the black kids who believe that garbage and give up on life before even trying - until the R's began firing back.  Only now when the R's are fighting back is it a problem.  Only now are people wondering why civility and cooperation are gone.

The 'Progressives' aren't going to stop - it's what Alinsky told them to do - and it is effective.  I doubt the R's at this point - having finally decided to fight instead of shrink away from the insults - are going to unilaterally just stop either.

[NowhereInTime]

WotR, you posted this on the Annoyed thread but I thought I'd answer it here.

It's more difficult when one party decides to start calling the other party 'racist' and 'Nazi's'.  When their election strategies revolve around telling old people the other party is going to steal their Social Security and want to poison the air and water. 

When the 'Progressives' took over that party, they upped the ante and said the WHOLE country is racist, from the slave owning Founding Fathers on.

It was all well and good - well, except for the black kids who believe that garbage and give up on life before even trying - until the R's began firing back.  Only now when the R's are fighting back is it a problem.  Only now are people wondering why civility and cooperation are gone.

The 'Progressives' aren't going to stop - it's what Alinsky told them to do - and it is effective.  I doubt the R's at this point - having finally decided to fight instead of shrink away from the insults - are going to unilaterally just stop either.

As you can see, West, the blame game never ends. 
Of course, having conservatives call liberals "Pinkos", "Communists", "Marxists", and "un-American" for wanting to do something like extend unemployment benefits or "Occupy thugs" when they protest the gaming of the American economy is completely A-OK because, well, its the "truth".

[NowhereInTime]

I failed to mention (for you home gamers) that was Paper*Boy's 1000th official "Alinsky" reference.
Even after googling Alinsky I just don't get it.

[Yorkshire pud]

As you can see, West, the blame game never ends. 
Of course, having conservatives call liberals "Pinkos", "Communists", "Marxists", and "un-American" for wanting to do something like extend unemployment benefits or "Occupy thugs" when they protest the gaming of the American economy is completely A-OK because, well, its the "truth".

W o t R is too much of a gent to rise to it I think.. He's even handed and sees both sides. Shame PB can't extend the courtesy.

[West of the Rockies]

Trying to discern who started the name-calling first is pointless... a review of available editorials going back decades, nay, centuries, reveals political opponents and their operatives have been spewing venom for a long time.  Deciding who started it all?  That famous line from War Games comes to mind:  "The only way to win is not to play."  If we try to go down that road, we all end up sounding like exhausted kids in the back of the family wagon driving from Oregon to Florida:  "Mom, Trixie keeps looking at me!"

"Trixie, stop looking at your brother."

"But he keeps looking at me!"

"Nobody look at anybody!"

Long pause...  "Mom, Trixie keeps almost touching my ear!"

Yes, Nowhere and Yorkie, my political brothers and friends (whose commentary I hold in the highest esteem), I do tend to perhaps play nicey-nice (as Tricky Dick used to say) and look to offer an olive branch.  But in fairness to Paperboy (who has always been civil and friendly to me), he did acknowledge that Republicans, now playing the name-calling game, aren't likely to put that genie back in the bottle anytime soon.  I think PB and I will disagree (perhaps vehemently) as to which party is more prolific and toxic in its attacks -- both parties now give pretty damn good.  Both parties have been proving Godwin's Law for a long time with the names fairly interchangeable:  Nazi, Jackbooted Thug, Marxist, Fascist... 

Sooner or later, the invectives turn to poop and sexual preference.  Personally, for me, the go-to insult is always "Your mother was a hamster, and your father smelt of elderberries!"

Oh, and QK, I fart in your general direction.

[PB the Deplorable]

W o t R is too much of a gent to rise to it I think.. He's even handed and sees both sides. Shame PB can't extend the courtesy.

Oh, I see both  sides, I just don't see them and their tactics as 'even'. 

I could probably argue the Left wing side better than most, it just isn't the side I mostly agree with.



For example today when Obama brazenly tells us he's "not going to sit around waiting for legislation", that he "has a pen and  phone" and he's going to push through whatever he wants by Executive Orders or by having the various agencies pump out more rules. 

That's not democracy.  That's not America.  That's a dictator.  Yes, he won the election, but the Constitution wasn't up for election.  It's his job to sit and wait for legislation if he is so unskilled and inexperienced as to not be able to work with, compromise, and prioritize to get legislation he wants legitimately under our system of government.  He has a 'catch me if you can' attitude.  No respect for our country.  No respect for our system.  No respect for the Constitution.  No respect for separation of powers.  No respect for the limits to his office.  Same with Harry Reid.  Same with the rest of the' Progressives' in DC. 

There's been no 'equivalent' to Obama or those other hacks in the Republican party.  Big Media backs him up all the way, but they would go ape shit if any Republican operated the way Obama does.

[PB the Deplorable]

Trying to discern who started the name-calling first is pointless...

Then I guess it's here to stay

[bateman]

http://news.yahoo.com/obama-dems-39-ll-act-without-congress-004736977--politics.html

So, rule by edict. Got it.

[PB the Deplorable]

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2014/01/14/obama-on-executive-actions-ive-got-a-pen-and-ive-got-a-phone/

[West of the Rockies]

Well, I recall GWB issuing oodles of so-called signing statements, thereby thwarting the spirit and letter of laws he did not like.  And we have never seen such blatant blocking of appointments in the past as we do with Obama's would-be appointees.

We all see things through our own filters I suppose.

[onan]

Well, I recall GWB issuing oodles of so-called signing statements, thereby thwarting the spirit and letter of laws he did not like.  And we have never seen such blatant blocking of appointments in the past as we do with Obama's would-be appointees.

We all see things through our own filters I suppose.

He did, Until Reagan there were a total of 74 signing statements. During Reagan, Bush I, and Clinton that number climbed close to 250. Bush, more than 700. I am not a legal scholar, but something seems to becoming entirely different than intended.

[eeieeyeoh]

This feels like a rabid thread.

[West of the Rockies]

Be afraid, eeiieeyeoh, be very afraid....

The gloves are off on these pages.

[Ben Shockley]

... that was Paper*Boy's 1000th official "Alinsky" reference.
Even after googling Alinsky I just don't get it.

Oh, you know, Nowhere: it's the "-sky/-ski" thing, remember?  Judeao-Slavs are just flat scary.
It's weird though: long-time hard-core Lefty that I am, I'd never heard of Saul Alinsky until the pants-pissing righties started hyperventilating his name!  Right-wing Cassandras all "know" so much and understand so little.

Viz:

The 'Progressives' aren't going to stop - it's what Alinsky told them to do...

I'm so thankful that I have Pavlovian*Boy to explain to me why I do things.
By the way: that's my new name for Paper*Boy -- "Pavlovian*Boy."  He couldn't possibly be any more predictable in his conditioned responses.

Another thing: sure, I get it that *Boy uses the term "progressive" as a catch-all intended insult for anyone opposed to his preferred vision of America, full-blown fascism.  But if the mealy-mouthed watered-down Democratic pols in the USA trigger *Boy's panic response (as evidenced by his using his worst-possible epithet "progressive" on them) what the hell would *Boy do if faced with any truly "progressive" politician?  Can he possibly fathom that the American pols he thinks are the epitome of "radical Marxism" are considered center-right by most of the world?
But I know: others like Pud have tried to educate him.  It's pointless.  He's here on a single-minded mission, and facts be damned.

[wr250]

wasnt alinsky (and ayers) running (or close to the top) of the american terrorist group "the weathermen" , which advocated violent overthrow of the american govt?

info from faux news:
They formed in 1969 and the main goal for their "revolution" was "the destruction of U.S. imperialism and the achievement of a classless world: World communism" and to "achieve the dictatorship of the proletariat."

several people were killed when one of thier bombs prematurely exploded.

[FightTheFuture]

wasnt alinsky (and ayers) running (or close to the top) of the american terrorist group "the weathermen" , which advocated violent overthrow of the american govt?

info from faux news:
They formed in 1969 and the main goal for their "revolution" was "the destruction of U.S. imperialism and the achievement of a classless world: World communism" and to "achieve the dictatorship of the proletariat."

several people were killed when one of thier bombs prematurely exploded.

Saul Alinsky was a liberal social activist. He wrote a very famous book called, "Rules For Radicals", which has become the bible for many progressives. The late, great Andrew Breitbart was instrumental in alerting many conservatives -- like myself -- to the reality that they were being out maneuvered in the political arena by Alinsky followers (see, Hillay Clinton, who worked closely with Alinsky in the 60`s).

One of Alinsky`s more nefarious rules was #12. You may have seen it put to use by the Obama campaign during the course of the last Presidential election: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions. (This is cruel, but very effective. Direct, personalized criticism and ridicule works.)

[wr250]

Saul Alinsky was a liberal social activist. He wrote a very famous book called, "Rules For Radicals", which has become the bible for many progressives. The late, great Andrew Breitbart was instrumental in alerting many conservatives -- like myself -- to the reality that they were being out maneuvered in the political arena by Alinsky followers (see, Hillay Clinton, who worked closely with Alinsky in the 60`s).

One of Alinsky`s more nefarious rules was #12. You may have seen it put to use by the Obama campaign during the course of the last Presidential election: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions. (This is cruel, but very effective. Direct, personalized criticism and ridicule works.)

looks like i was wrong on this one.

[PB the Deplorable]

looks like i was wrong on this one.

You were half right.  Obama's neighbor, fellow radical, and BFF is domestic Weather Underground terrorist Bill Ayes.