What a speech.

[Yorkshire pud]

There was a ten hour debate before the vote to send the RAF into Syria yesterday. Ayes and nays from all sides of the house. It didn't fall down party lines and had some truly inspiring speeches from all sides.

This one though gave me goosebumps.

His father was a great orator. I didn't agree with much his father passionately believed. Few though had anything but great respect for his profound intelligence, conviction and decency.. The fruit hasn't fallen far from the tree. I won't vote Labour, but this guy is awe inspiring.

Hilary Benn: 'IS hold our democracy in contempt' - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34991402

[21st Century Man]

There was a ten hour debate before the vote to send the RAF into Syria yesterday. Ayes and nays from all sides of the house. It didn't fall down party lines and had some truly inspiring speeches from all sides.

This one though gave me goosebumps.

His father was a great orator. I didn't agree with much his father passionately believed. Few though had anything but great respect for his profound intelligence, conviction and decency.. The fruit hasn't fallen far from the tree. I won't vote Labour, but this guy is awe inspiring.

Hilary Benn: 'IS hold our democracy in contempt' -http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34991402

Links not working.  Hard to copy. I'll try to fix it.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34991402

[21st Century Man]

You do have a great country, YP.  I'm a big Anglophile.  I do wish you had a leader of Churchill's stature.  I am very troubled about GB's future. Your country is in my prayers.

[21st Century Man]

Well, that was very moving. While I do not share some of the foreign secretary's views regarding the UN and calling ISIS Daesh, I do applaud much of what he had to say.  I do think as allies we should consider other measures besides air strikes.  Strategic tactical units that would take out certain targets that drones and planes can't get to. MI6 on steroids if you will.   Maybe such strikes should not be announced but done in secret.  Use the Seals, Green Berets, CIA and other covert operations units.  Perhaps that is already being done.

[Yorkshire pud]

Well, that was very moving. While I do not share some of the foreign secretary's views regarding the UN and calling ISIS Daesh, I do applaud much of what he had to say.  I do think as allies we should consider other measures besides air strikes.  Strategic tactical units that would take out certain targets that drones and planes can't get to. MI6 on steroids if you will.   Maybe such strikes should not be announced but done in secret.  Use the Seals, Green Berets, CIA and other covert operations units.  Perhaps that is already being done.

Hilary Benn is the shadow Foreign Sec. (Opposition) He voted against his own leader, and FOR the government's stance. It was a free vote though so the whip wasn't called in to get the respective troops into line.

[21st Century Man]

Hilary Benn is the shadow Foreign Sec. (Opposition) He voted against his own leader, and FOR the government's stance. It was a free vote though so the whip wasn't called in to get the respective troops into line.

There's a special place in my heart for people who buck the party line.  That man may have a future as prime minister.  We shall see. Thanks for posting, YP.

[BellBoy]

There was a ten hour debate before the vote to send the RAF into Syria yesterday. Ayes and nays from all sides of the house. It didn't fall down party lines and had some truly inspiring speeches from all sides.

This one though gave me goosebumps.

His father was a great orator. I didn't agree with much his father passionately believed. Few though had anything but great respect for his profound intelligence, conviction and decency.. The fruit hasn't fallen far from the tree. I won't vote Labour, but this guy is awe inspiring.

Hilary Benn: 'IS hold our democracy in contempt' - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34991402

Truly a well reasoned argument and with a most impassioned delivery. I especially like the fact that when he refers to the Syrian leader, it sounds curiously like he's saying "President Ass-hat".

[Yorkshire pud]

Churchill was a traitor and extreme war criminal.

FUCK YOURSELF; just go, you're the phlegm that every bilious hacking toad has in the back of it's throat. Go back and live in the little hole you call home, happy to be sitting in your piss and shit, secure that like minded functionally celibate cowards such as you can hold masturbatory online chats telling each other how wonderful you wish you could be.

I'm sure you also have your bad points too.

[SredniVashtar]

FUCK YOURSELF; just go, you're the phlegm that every bilious hacking toad has in the back of it's throat. Go back and live in the little hole you call home, happy to be sitting in your piss and shit, secure that like minded functionally celibate cowards such as you can hold masturbatory online chats telling each other how wonderful you wish you could be.

I'm sure you also have your bad points too.

I'm pretty sure dear Uncle Adolf would have wanted peace for the time being until it suited his purposes to invade. It's always interesting to hear a Nazi bleat on about war crimes. There is always this master-slave thing about them - they are either trying to kick you in the face or lick your boots.

And don't knock masturbatory online chats - it's how we met, after all. 

[Yorkshire pud]

didn't want to offend your man-crush on the guy, my apologies.

You still here? Haven't you any Hitler youth photos to wank over?

[21st Century Man]

Churchill was a traitor and extreme war criminal. You owe the mass-invasion of 3rd worlders who rape European women to him.
Hitler was a great admirer of England. Always wanted to have peace and regarded you as an ally. Let your troops escape from Dunkirk when he could have slaughtered them all. As a thanks Churchill firebombed German cities full of civilians and refugees (lots of Russians too) to demoralize the people.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37Oxb110P0Q
enjoy some real history if you want.

Oh great.  A Nazi apologist.  You know what, your Fuhrer was a piece of shit who attacked Britain long before Britain attacked Germany.  Hitler was the lowest piece of scum the Earth has ever produced.  Only Stalin may have been worse.  My last name is Hovis, a German name, and I am ashamed of that little piece of dogshit who claimed to be German.  Fuck you, Auric.

[Yorkshire pud]

Oh great.  A Nazi apologist.  You know what, your Fuhrer was a piece of shit who attacked Britain long before Britain attacked Germany.  Hitler was the lowest piece of scum the Earth has ever produced.  Only Stalin may have been worse.  My last name is Hovis, a German name, and I am ashamed of that little piece of dogshit who claimed to be German.  Fuck you, Auric.

You're fortunate. Hitler was Austrian; guess what? So is GF. Hitler was also half Jewish.. Oh the irony.

[Yorkshire pud]

there's nothing to apologize about.
only regret that Hitler lost.
PS. obviously I don't believe in the 6gazillion holocaust myth.

You have one ball too fucker?

[Yorkshire pud]

nobody ever proved Hitler was half jewish, and if he was, it doesn't matter.

Touched a nerve fucker?

[21st Century Man]

the problem is, we're all being told lies about Hitler and WW2.
I recommend you watch this 6h Documentary about Hitler (in episodes), it's not perfect but gives a much better picture of what was really going on.


http://tgsnt.tv/

Neo-nazi propaganda.  Go peddle it somewhere else.

[21st Century Man]

You're fortunate. Hitler was Austrian; guess what? So is GF. Hitler was also half Jewish.. Oh the irony.

Yeah, I know but he liked to think of himself as German.  He indeed was half-Jewish and hid it well.

[21st Century Man]

nobody ever proved Hitler was half jewish, and if he was, it doesn't matter. He was a great man.

He was a piece of shit and that is insulting to shit.

[21st Century Man]

prove it

LOL. I have Hitler's DNA in my basement freezer.  It might take some time to thaw out.

[Yorkshire pud]

prove it

Hey, it doesn't matter. Forget it eh? Being half Jewish isn't a crime, but as you said, his father wouldn't have been accepted as Jewish even if he'd converted...all that anxiety must have been passed on to the young painter corporal eh?

[21st Century Man]

you should be careful not to sound like a liberal SJW when debating, insulting people and not bringing any arguments to the table never really looks good.

ROTFLMAO!!!  Oh my.  Someone accusing me of being a liberal.  Oh the irony.  You're a riot, Auric. 

[SredniVashtar]

My last name is Hovis.

I bet it's easy to get a rise out of you. 

Sorry, I had to make a stab at a lame joke. I bet Yorkie is in floods of tears right now, thinking about cobbled streets and Dvorak playing in the background.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgjLJSuGPt8

[21st Century Man]

as somebody pointed out, on my scale you might indeed be a liberal., but I don't know you, so I just said "don't *sound* like one".

Its all a matter of degrees, eh Auric?  Well I do like to think that I have an open mind so maybe you're right. If I am then I'm proud to be one.  However my voting record betrays me.  I guess you could call me a classical liberal as opposed to what passes for a liberal in my country.

[Yorkshire pud]

I bet it's easy to get a rise out of you. 

Sorry, I had to make a stab at a lame joke. I bet Yorkie is in floods of tears right now, thinking about cobbled streets and Dvorak playing in the background.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgjLJSuGPt8

Yes, but it was filmed in Shaftsbury, Dorset. I've been on that very street. Moto Guzzi camp weekend is held there each year, or at least used to be. Lots of Italian rats piss beer drunk.

[BellBoy]

as somebody pointed out, on my scale you might indeed be a liberal., but I don't know you, so I just said "don't *sound* like one".

Ha! On your scale, Adolf Eichmann might "indeed be a liberal"! After all, he could have marched them into the "labour" camps much, much faster, if he'd only tried. The lazy, liberal fucker.

[21st Century Man]

I bet it's easy to get a rise out of you. 

Sorry, I had to make a stab at a lame joke. I bet Yorkie is in floods of tears right now, thinking about cobbled streets and Dvorak playing in the background.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgjLJSuGPt8

Aww, the video is not available to my region. Rise out of you?  Got it.  LOL.  I bet it was for Hovis bread.  I'm very familiar with it. I get it occasionally when I go to the Decatur Farmer's Market which has a wide variety of international foods.

[21st Century Man]

Here's a cartoon for you Auric.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jI9QzNVJK1s

[21st Century Man]

Doesn't really matter, but I never heard the name Hovis before in Austria or Germany.

Hovis is an anglicized version of the name.  My ancestor came over from the Germanic kingdoms during the American Revolution and fought against the British.  In German, the name is something like Hovistein or something along those lines.

[SredniVashtar]

Sorry to get off-topic here, but getting back to that speech, which I haven't actually seen yet.

(By the way, if you want to debate the merits of National Socialism, you might be better off on the Art Bell thread - there are plenty of Nazis on there, trust me.)

Why do people get swayed by stuff like this? We had this with Tony Blair in 2003, when his glib oiliness helped to convince everyone that Saddam was about to blow us all out of our beds, and it all turned out to be total and utter bollox (copyright YP).

If I had to guess, it's a holdover from the days when people had a classical education and put much more emphasis on rhetoric that it deserves. If someone has a sound argument then it doesn't need to be spoken out loud - all it means is that people confuse emotion for intelligence and we get ourselves into the sorts of messes we find ourselves in again now.

[albrecht]

Well to wade into deep waters, and stir the pot, both Churchill and Hitler had speech-making abilities. Clearly they differed on "the JEEWS" but the South Africans, Irish, Indians, etc likely don't have much truck with Churchill. And, after all, Jerusalem in "this green and pleasant land," etc.
"I do not agree that the dog in a
manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain
there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for
instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America
or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been
done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade
race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken
their place."-Peel Commission Report, proof copy of Churchill's evidence: Churchill papers, 2/317

Having said that I side with Churchill. Though Enoch was right.

[21st Century Man]

Well to wade into deep waters, and stir the pot, both Churchill and Hitler had speech-making abilities. Clearly they differed on "the JEEWS" but the South Africans, Irish, Indians, etc likely don't have much truck with Churchill. And, after all, Jerusalem in "this green and pleasant land," etc.
"I do not agree that the dog in a
manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain
there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for
instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America
or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been
done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade
race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken
their place."-Peel Commission Report, proof copy of Churchill's evidence: Churchill papers, 2/317

Having said that I side with Churchill. Though Enoch was right.

Well, I would disagree with Churchill on that issue but he was a product of his time. Many people thought the same way and they didn't believe in genocide.