Flight 4U9525 Crash in Southern French Alps (Meolans-Revels)

[Falkie2013]

Fox too.

Flash from Fox News just in.

German co pilot appears to have wanted to destroy the plane.

The co-pilot of the doomed Germanwings flight appeared to want to 'destroy the plane,' French prosecutor says after reports of pilot locked out of cockpit

More on this story: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/03/26/more-questions-than-answers-after-report-that-germanwings-pilot-locked-out/

I told Drone and Kathy Tuesday night it was either terrorism or someone deliberately crashing plane in cockpit.

[Nick el Ass]

Word is that the co-pilot decided to lock the main pilot out of the cockpit after he went to the bathroom, and you can here him trying to knock on the door and kick it open when he was done... and the guy who took control can be heard breathing calmly over the radio before you hear the screams from the passengers as he crashed the plane.


/I don't understand how these people decided that instead of just taking themselves out they are going to take a bunch of innocent people with them. Sad news.

[albrecht]

Any scuttlebutt or even conspiracy theory if no real facts are known about this pilot? Any odd facebook posts or connections (religious, cults, drug/alcohol problems, mental counseling, prescriptions, recent divorce or break-up, work demotions, financial problems, etc?) Any odd trading on LHA prior? Any claims of responsibility by the usual suspects? I see blurb about "depression" but no real details though (was he diagnosed earlier but deemed "ok", still on meds or counseling (or both), coming off, etc etc.) Also, suicide is one thing. Awful tragedy for family always but killing 149 other people unrelated to you simply because you want to kill yourself? That is not normal depression or suicide m.o. (I would think, or at least hope, but related to something else also.)

[Faustina]

Pretty shocked that it seems it was a suicidal act by the co-pilot.  Nearly downright evil to end so many lives along with your own, causing countless suffering to the families of those killed.  Someone srsly screwed up with a grudge against humanity, I suspect.  How vulnerable we are to the mental states of pilots when we fly.

[Nick el Ass]

They might start making the pilots pee in jugs, bags, or something to make sure there are two people in the cockpit at all times from here on out.

[Up All Night]

They might start making the pilots pee in jugs, bags, or something to make sure there are two people in the cockpit at all times from here on out.

Or, start requiring these as part of the uniform:

[Juan]

There are now reports out of Germany that the co-pilot was a Muslim convert who attended a radical mosque with some connection to Mohammed Atta.  We'll see I suppose.

[3OctaveFart]

This dude only had 630 flight hours.
A friend of mine only has 200 fewer than that.
They just do things differently in Europe.
That he was a pampered rich kid did no harm.
Once again, some loser can't cope with the swells of life and good people have to pay their lives for it.

[Lord Grantham]

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/27/europe/france-germanwings-plane-crash-main/

'Germanwings co-pilot Andreas Lubitz was hiding an illness from his employers and had been declared "unfit to work" by a doctor, according to German authorities"

What a dipshit.

[Nick el Ass]

Or, start requiring these as part of the uniform:

Yeah. I saw on BBC news that most companies do have polices that make it so two people have to be in the cockpit at once even if it is a stewardess... but this company wasn't one of them. I think they should hand out depends to people who are flying as well because you never now when something crazy is going to happen, and there is a old saying about making sure you go out with clean undergarments.

There are now reports out of Germany that the co-pilot was a Muslim convert who attended a radical mosque with some connection to Mohammed Atta.  We'll see I suppose.

I'm surprised it took this long for someone to try to make the guy seem like he was Muslim even if it wasn't true. Unfortunately, I think this guy may have just been mentally ill.

[Zetaspeak]

Yeah. I saw on BBC news that most companies do have polices that make it so two people have to be in the cockpit at once even if it is a stewardess... but this company wasn't one of them. I think they should hand out depends to people who are flying as well because you never now when something crazy is going to happen, and there is a old saying about making sure you go out with clean undergarments.

I'm surprised it took this long for someone to try to make the guy seem like he was Muslim even if it wasn't true. Unfortunately, I think this guy may have just been mentally ill.

I do wonder how different the coverage would be if the pilot had a middle eastern name or look. Would we even look at these outside circumstances if he was?

There certainly is sad irony that we were so paranoid that we made the cockpit doors super locked where nothing can get in, the same safety mechanism that didn't allow the pilot to get back into the cockpit.

As much as we would like to, we can never be 100% safe. I heard some people saying "Why not have the plane being controlled by remote control" which of course begs the question, how do we know for certain who's behind the controls.

[Yorkshire pud]

This dude only had 630 flight hours.
A friend of mine only has 200 fewer than that.
They just do things differently in Europe.
That he was a pampered rich kid did no harm.
Once again, some loser can't cope with the swells of life and good people have to pay their lives for it.

You think that depression is being a loser? You know the irony/disgust? The British tabloid filth (Dally Mail/Sun etc) called the pilot 'crazy', 'Madman' and all the other lowest common denominator epithets used for mental illness by the hard of thinking. The Daily Mail are a right wing bigoted mouthpiece for the hard of thinking; and not that long ago declared that mental illness wasn't an excuse NOT to hold a job. Now apparently without any medical knowledge in the field of psychiatry they determine that depression is a pre-curser to mass murder. I will lay a bet that there are many members of this forum who are dealing with or have dealt with depression and hold very responsible jobs. And a great many more who deal with a family member with depression. But the rags reduce it to 'madness', and the bogeyman. Fucking 21st century?

[3OctaveFart]

He was a spoiled brat, typical millennial.
Three hundred and fifty million people suffer from depression and this one LOSER decided to bring down 150 people with him.
The little bag of shit even bragged to his girlfriend he would be world-famous in a few days.
Go play your violin for people who actually deserve it.

[Humilia Lepus Foramen]

Speaking as someone of his generation, I'm not sure I'd trust a large commercial airplane with someone that age at the wheel even if they are mentally stable.  Added to the list of the many reasons I avoid air travel. 

[Yorkshire pud]

He was a spoiled brat, typical millennial.
Three hundred and fifty million people suffer from depression and this one LOSER decided to bring down 150 people with him.
The little bag of shit even bragged to his girlfriend he would be world-famous in a few days.
Go play your violin for people who actually deserve it.

What are you struggling with? Where did I say his depression was an excuse?

[Yorkshire pud]

Speaking as someone of his generation, I'm not sure I'd trust a large commercial airplane with someone that age at the wheel even if they are mentally stable.  Added to the list of the many reasons I avoid air travel.

Why not? My sister in law's brother was (when he worked there) the youngest Captain that British Airways had-aged 21. Military jet pilots are young; 23-24 isn't unusual for those with several hundred hours flying time in fast jets.

[Humilia Lepus Foramen]

You make a good point, but it's a matter of preference for me.  Most 21 year olds I've known aren't exactly paragons of responsibility.

[Yorkshire pud]

You make a good point, but it's a matter of preference for me.  Most 21 year olds I've known aren't exactly paragons of responsibility.

There needs to be some perspective. In the UK anyone able to read a number plate at a set distance and over 17 and pass a theory and practical exam can hold a full driving licence. There is no aptitude testing; no assessment of decision making thereafter on a regular basis. No medicals unless the driver holds a heavy goods or bus driving licence. Until aged 70. Commercial pilots of any age are regularly assessed. Millions of miles are flown. Does anyone question the age of a train driver? Age isn't the issue. This man was clearly very disturbed and it seems at first sight dreadfully selfish. He had a problem and made the decision to take another 149 innocent people with him. But his age nor his flying log (hours) I don't think is relevant.

[Humilia Lepus Foramen]

I'm not arguing with anything you've said as there may well be good young pilots.  Not saying his age was the reason for the crash just that me personally, I'm already not into flying as is, if I did have to fly I'd prefer a seasoned veteran or two at the helm.  Just like some people prefer the color blue over red, or brunettes over blondes, I like my pilots older and experienced.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/netherlands/11506244/Dutch-pilot-predicted-French-Alps-crash.html

The whole thing is obviously a tragedy.  It seems like a bit of a Kobiyashi Maru - you keep out the potential bad guys but maybe also keeping in a mentally unstable person.  Thankfully this is a very rare occurrence.  Two people in the cockpit at all times may be the simplest answer.

[albrecht]

The whole thing is obviously a tragedy.  It seems like a bit of a Kobiyashi Maru - you keep out the potential bad guys but maybe also keeping in a mentally unstable person.  Thankfully this is a very rare occurrence.  Two people in the cockpit at all times may be the simplest answer.

Two in the cockpit didn't help with Egypt Air 990, at least according to our FTSB. And he wasn't young but actually approaching forced retirement. I still far safer flying than I do on our highways with the bad drivers, the trucks, the texters, the drunks, etc. It is just a plane crash is more scary because of mass casualties/death and being totally helpless (whereas one thinks he could "out maneuver" from a car crash.)

Sadly, in some positions or scenarios it might be that people need to "give up" a bit of their privacy with related to mental issues, financial problems, alcohol/drug abuse, etc. Similar to how most countries, or States, require someone like a doctor, teacher, etc to report child sexual abuse maybe it should be required to tell authorities if they hold these positions of immediate responsibility. Or, if not, than at least a robust way of checking internally, "anonymous reporting of colleagues", or spot-checks.

Of course the biggest problem is if you face losing your career, being stigmatized in the community, and suffering a serious mental/alcohol/drug problem you might not wish to seek help, or at least, not inform your employer. One would hope through training (and re-training) these people would muster out or be identified and no system is perfect but a better one might help.

In addition to have at least 2 in cockpit, and more checking on stability of pilots, what about actually using the supposed, "fly-by-wire" as a stop-gap? If pilot(s) doesn't respond to radio/internet calls or starts making odd, evasive patterns than the flight-control system is locked out and goes into a holding pattern until the situation can be figured out?

[Humilia Lepus Foramen]

Yes, that too.  At the end of the day unfortunately there's no way to be 100% safe, c'est la vie.

Also I have refined my preference if I absolutely positively have to fly - not too young and inexperienced, not too old and with dwindling physical/mental capacities, but middle-aged and just right