Author Topic: The Official BellGab.com 9/11 Thread  (Read 109156 times)

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The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #450 on: February 28, 2015, 12:56:24 PM »
I've always been interested in the events of this day. I have read numerous books about it and watched as many videos as I can about it. That being said, although I find the conspiracy theories entertaining, I believe they have no merit.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #451 on: February 28, 2015, 01:33:26 PM »
I've always been interested in the events of this day. I have read numerous books about it and watched as many videos as I can about it. That being said, although I find the conspiracy theories entertaining, I believe they have no merit.

Agreed.

I would like to see some specific conspiracy claims posted to this thread so that they can be annihilated.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #452 on: February 28, 2015, 01:38:09 PM »
I'm not a 911 "truther" and I generally find that people who fall into this class are idiots with high school educations at best who think they're engineers because they watched a DVD their buddy handed over.  Thus, I give you:

www.debunking911.com/

Nano-fucking-thermite?  Addressed here.  Pools of molten steel?  Addressed here.  Suspicious quotes?  Addressed here.  It's a one stop shop to get your mind right and move on with life.

Your comments are welcome.


Wow, you make it sound so inviting to have a conversation about 911… the official BellGab 911 thread starts with a predetermined outcome.

It's just like US Diplomacy,  "You are either with US or you are an idiot."   The choice is yours, good sir.

 


The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #453 on: February 28, 2015, 01:59:12 PM »
I will take the bait. I will be your whipping boy. But first I must confess….. I AM A TRUTHer! A proud shameless, handed-out videos truther idiot…. but wait, there's more…. I even went to College. I have a B.S. from the University of Florida. I know about the Scientific method and spent three wasted years in Graduate school in Austin, Texas… I even have the student loans to prove it! 

If i have been fooling myself, I want to know about it.  Please help me understand. Please squelch my curious mind, ease my concerns. Help me make peace of 911 so I can get on with my life.


 



I think the format is to present your hypothesis; formulate an experiment to establish the findings; Present the results; offer them for peer revue and revision, and then try to reproduce the same results with the experiment.. Present the conclusions.


The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #454 on: February 28, 2015, 02:17:55 PM »
1.) True or False:  On or about Sept.10th, 2001, Donald Rumsfeld testified before the Senate about the Pentagon's inability to account for over $1 trillion in missing funds?

2.) True or False: The wing of the pentagon that was hit by 'the plane' contained mostly financial records, was recently under construction, and was, thankfully, understaffed, compared to the other parts of the building?

3.) True or False: After 911, No one asked pentagon officials where the missing $1 Trillion in appropriated funds went, nor suggested we audit their activities or cut their budget ever again.

4.) True or False: the War on Terror is predicted to last the rest of our life times and may never end? Therefore military motives and budgets should never be questioned again.

5.) True or False: There was a department of defense drill happening the exact morning of 911.  This important drill involved the high-jacking of airplanes and was designed to practice our response to mid-air high-jackings. I believe it was called, "Operation Able Danger."

6.) True or False: Art Bell quit in part because of 911 and people's response to it. Their need to talk about it, to understand it, what happened.

7.) True or False: Papi Bush, the then President's father, was having breakfast with a member of the Bin Laden family on the morning of 911.

That ought to get the yelling and screaming started.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #455 on: February 28, 2015, 02:22:39 PM »




Ok, MV, I'm calling you out to help facilitate this dialogue.  I don't have time to re-read everything, but I do have questions you can help me understand.. Like…

How are there molten pools of Steel in the basements of the Towers without explosives being involved?

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #456 on: February 28, 2015, 02:37:32 PM »


This video, while cute and easy on the eyes, doesn't really show anything.  I believe the Pentagon questions  have to do with the Size of the hole left by the plane. It doesn't match at all the size of Boeing 757.  There should be two huge holes where the Engines met the face of the building. Also suspicious is the way the blast hole goes through about six layers of reinforced concrete and leaves a near perfect missile-like exit hole, that the aluminum nose of a commercial plane would not be able to duplicate.

The video you show to Debunk the pentagon conspiracy does nothing to address the two main issues…. size of the entry hole and the size of the exit hole six layers into the building. Also the trajectory of the plane seems nearly impossible. And even more impossible is to think that the Pentagon let itself get hit by a commercial plane without firing a shot. And that their cameras are so shitty that they missed the frames of video with the actual plane in it!  That animation is clearly deceptive, trying to put a plane into a video where plainly, there is no plane. It's plain as day.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #457 on: February 28, 2015, 02:41:04 PM »
This video, while cute and easy on the eyes, doesn't really show anything.  I believe the Pentagon questions  have to do with the Size of the hole left by the plane. It doesn't match at all the size of Boeing 727.

Why should it? It was hit by a 757.


Quote
  There should be two huge holes where the Engines met the face of the building. Also suspicious is the way the blast hole goes through about six layers of reinforced concrete and leaves a near perfect missile-like exit hole, that the aluminum nose of a commercial plane would not be able to duplicate.

You've a degree in science? Did you cover fluid dynamics?

Quote
The video you show to Debunk the pentagon conspiracy does nothing to address the two main issues…. size of the entry hole and the size of the exit hole six layers into the building. Also the trajectory of the plane seems nearly impossible. And even more impossible is to think that the Pentagon let itself get hit by a big-ol, slow commercial plane without firing a shot. And that there cameras are so shitty that they missed the frames of video with the actual plane in it!  That animation is clearly deceptive.

A big ole slow commercial airliner that can fly at over 500 mph? That slow? What do you know about aeroplanes? Roughly?

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #458 on: February 28, 2015, 02:46:08 PM »
I can tell Pud is clearly not going to get involved in anything other than petty distractions. What about the True or False questions I posted.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #459 on: February 28, 2015, 02:47:22 PM »
I know nothing about airplanes, I am simply telling you what people think and why. I do however have a brain and am capable of independent thought. I make up my own mind after reviewing different perspectives. You should try it sometime.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #460 on: February 28, 2015, 02:50:57 PM »
I can tell Pud is clearly not going to get involved in anything other than petty distractions. What about the True or False questions I posted.

Well I assume the true or false questions are pre ordained? In other words you have the answers (True perchance?) and therefore not worth arguing about? Am I right?

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #461 on: February 28, 2015, 02:54:25 PM »
Well I assume the true or false questions are pre ordained? In other words you have the answers (True perchance?) and therefore not worth arguing about? Am I right?

I thought you people wanted to know why people like me could possibly believe something different than you. But you don't want to know, you just want to throw stones at me.


The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #462 on: February 28, 2015, 02:55:44 PM »
Follow the logic where it takes you… Fear not the truth. Wherever it may lead.  This is the scientific method. Science doesn't fear hypothesis. It welcomes challenges to its existing thought patterns. You are leading an emotional challenge against me personally. I ask you to stop it. And engage the data!

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #463 on: February 28, 2015, 02:55:50 PM »
I know nothing about airplanes, I am simply telling you what people think and why. I do however have a brain and am capable of independent thought. I make up my own mind after reviewing different perspectives. You should try it sometime.


If you're going to establish 'fact' regarding (in this case) the capabilities and non capabilities of an airliner you really ought to be able to back it up with knowledge. You can't say that a 757 is a 'big ole slow' plane, when it patently isn't. If you had any knowledge of aeroplanes, their capabilities, their design parameters, and how engineers arrive at the designs, you'd not make such ridiculous remarks and present them as fact.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #464 on: February 28, 2015, 02:59:18 PM »

If you're going to establish 'fact' regarding (in this case) the capabilities and non capabilities of an airliner you really ought to be able to back it up with knowledge. You can't say that a 757 is a 'big ole slow' plane, when it patently isn't. If you had any knowledge of aeroplanes, their capabilities, their design parameters, and how engineers arrive at the designs, you'd not make such ridiculous remarks and present them as fact.

Ok asshole, here's a question for you:    Is a commercial plane the same as a fighter plane? that is the only comparison I was implying. You don't need a degree in aerospace engineering to make that distinction. I assume the pentagon is readied against fighter planes.

You are leading an emotional challenge against me personally. I ask you to stop it. And engage the data!

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #465 on: February 28, 2015, 03:00:21 PM »
I thought you people wanted to know why people like me could possibly believe something different than you. But you don't want to know, you just want to throw stones at me.

So far you've presented a few true/false questions that as far as you're concerned have only one answer; got the aircraft type that hit the Pentagon wrong; decided it's slow based on what, I have no idea. You haven't yet presented any hypothesis, or experiments that prove your conclusions.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #466 on: February 28, 2015, 03:04:00 PM »
If you want to know why an educated person would believe in 911 conspiracy I can tell you all day long.  But I request that you respond to what I am saying with earnest, researched, foot-noted, book-marked, double-fact checked, peer-reviewed and moderator tested answers only.   

And if you can't do that, at least be fucking polite. BellGAB JERKS! No wonder Faulkie abandoned you.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #467 on: February 28, 2015, 03:04:16 PM »
Ok asshole, here's a question for you:


Asshole? Hmmm, yeah, your powers of persuasion aren't high...

Quote
   Is a commercial plane the same as a fighter plane?

No; but who said it was? And don't run away with the idea that fighters are superior in all aspects of the flight envelope; they're not.

Quote
that is the only comparison I was implying. You don't need a degree in aerospace engineering to make that distinction. I assume the pentagon is readied against fighter planes.

Are they? I have no idea if they are or not.

Quote
You are leading an emotional challenge against me personally. I ask you to stop it. And engage the data!

Present the data then...I'm not emotional, but I think you are.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #468 on: February 28, 2015, 03:06:01 PM »
So far you've presented a few true/false questions that as far as you're concerned have only one answer; got the aircraft type that hit the Pentagon wrong; decided it's slow based on what, I have no idea. You haven't yet presented any hypothesis, or experiments that prove your conclusions.


Pud, I'm not going to do that. Many people besides me have already made the case. Ask me a question, I tell you no lies. But i can't prove anything. I can only tell you why I feel that way.   You prove to me why I'm wrong.

Were all my True or False questions True? That's what I heard…. It feeds into what I believe… Am I wrong on any of them?
Did you bother to check it out? Help me debunk myself.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #469 on: February 28, 2015, 03:07:15 PM »
If you want to know why an educated person would believe in 911 conspiracy I can tell you all day long.  But I request that you respond to what I am saying with earnest, researched, foot-noted, book-marked, double-fact checked, peer-reviewed and moderator tested answers only.   

And if you can't do that, at least be fucking polite. BellGAB JERKS! No wonder Faulkie abandoned you.

You haven't said anything yet. You're the impolite one; so far you've said I'm an asshole and a jerk,. I haven't extended the same epithets to you.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #470 on: February 28, 2015, 03:09:31 PM »
You haven't said anything yet. You're the impolite one; so far you've said I'm an asshole and a jerk,. I haven't extended the same epithets to you.

Ok Fair enough, i guess. I retract the asshole and jerk. Even though the thread starts off calling people like me idiots and retards.


The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #471 on: February 28, 2015, 03:10:51 PM »

Pud, I'm not going to do that. Many people besides me have already made the case. Ask me a question, I tell you no lies. But i can't prove anything. I can only tell you why I feel that way.   You prove to me why I'm wrong.

Were all my True or False questions True? That's what I heard…. It feeds into what I believe… Am I wrong on any of them?
Did you bother to check it out? Help me debunk myself.


You see, that's the issue isn't it? You can't be bothered or are unable to prove anything, but insist others 'do the research'. It's you who is trying to reveal the 'truth' is it not? In life as in court, the prosecution has to prove the case. So prove your case..unequivocally and without any other interpretation to your version...

The floor is yours.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #472 on: February 28, 2015, 03:11:04 PM »
Help Me Debunk Myself.      That is perfect right corner material, right there.  I really mean it.  Get to Debunking, Pud. Stop insulting. Start Debunking.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #473 on: February 28, 2015, 03:13:19 PM »

You see, that's the issue isn't it? You can't be bothered or are unable to prove anything, but insist others 'do the research'. It's you who is trying to reveal the 'truth' is it not? In life as in court, the prosecution has to prove the case. So prove your case..unequivocally and without any other interpretation to your version...

The floor is yours.

Look, you create an impossible, conversation stopping request when you do that. If I dumped all the evidence on you, you wouldn't listen for that long.  Let's take it 7 or 8 simple True or False statements at a time.

I'm completely open to being wrong. Are you?


The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #474 on: February 28, 2015, 03:14:59 PM »
Help Me Debunk Myself.      That is perfect right corner material, right there.  I really mean it.  Get to Debunking, Pud. Stop insulting. Start Debunking.


I haven't insulted you, and you haven't presented anything to debunk.

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #475 on: February 28, 2015, 03:15:55 PM »
I'm here to Debunk myself.  Help Me Debunk Myself.

and if that isn't Right Corner by the end of the day, I call Shenanigans, no tin foil hat needed. 

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #476 on: February 28, 2015, 03:16:35 PM »
Look, you create an impossible, conversation stopping request when you do that. If I dumped all the evidence on you, you wouldn't listen for that long.  Let's take it 7 or 8 simple True or False statements at a time.

I'm completely open to being wrong. Are you?


When you present your facts; are you absolutely and utterly sure it's the only and true possible conclusion to your hypothesis? Or are you making the conclusions fit your preconceived hypothesis?

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #477 on: February 28, 2015, 03:18:11 PM »

I haven't insulted you, and you haven't presented anything to debunk.

Pud, there are 7 statement of fact for you to debunk. You haven't said a word about them since I posted them. That is what I led my position with.  Plus, I stated that the video MV posted didn't really address the concerns stated in Loose Change's challenge to the Pentagon story.

It's not my story. I'm not a effen prosecutor, nor lawyer, nor judge… either join the conversation about the conspiracy or STFU

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #478 on: February 28, 2015, 03:24:56 PM »
Pud, there are 7 statement of fact for you to debunk. You haven't said a word about them since I posted them. That is what I led my position with.  Plus, I stated that the video MV posted didn't really address the concerns stated in Loose Change's challenge to the Pentagon story.

It's not my story. I'm not a effen prosecutor, nor lawyer, nor judge… either join the conversation about the conspiracy or STFU


As I said before, you've presented 7 statements that I presume you've already established must be true. Loose Change is so full of holes, it's been taken apart by many experts in their respective fields.

You're not a lawyer I know; but a crime was committed, so present your evidence as a lawyer would, to establish the guilt of your perceived defendant(s).

The Official BellGab 911 Thread
« Reply #479 on: February 28, 2015, 03:28:23 PM »
Good news, I've gotten plenty wrong already. I must be a complete idiot and retarded moron to believe anything I write. One of my earlier posted True or False questions is actually False.  Here's the facts:   

On the morning of 9/11, there were several military exercises taking place, some of which allegedly mirrored the events taking place that day.

A lot of different people didn’t know whether or not the hijackings were “real-world or exercise.”

According to Richard Clarke, on the morning of 9/11 at around 9:28am, he says to Gen. Richard Myers during a video teleconference “I assume NORAD has scrambled fighters and AWACS. How many? Where?” Myers, who is at the Pentagon, replies it’s, “NOT A PRETTY PICTURE, DICK (emphasis mine). WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF VIGILANT WARRIOR, A NORAD EXERCISE (emphasis mine), but Otis has launched two birds toward New York. Langley is trying to get two up now [toward Washington]. The AWACS are at Tinker and not on alert.” The 9/11 Report only mentioned one of these exercises, Vigilant Guardian, and in a footnote in the back of the book.

On 2/25/2005, then Rep. Cynthia McKinney asked (realplayer required) Donald Rumsfeld about the exercises that were taking place on 9/11, but did not get an answer on that day.

On 3/10/2005, Rep. McKinney asked Donald Rumsfeld, and Gen. Richard Myers about the exercises again. The first question asked by Rep. McKinney was, “whether or not the activities of the 4 wargames going on on Sept. 11th actually impaired our ability to respond to the attacks.” Gen. Myers responded with, “the answer to the question is, no, did not impair our response. In fact, Gen. Eberhart who was in the command of the North American Aerospace Defense Command as he testified in front of the 9/11 Commission… I believe…I believe he told them that it enhanced our ability to respond.” Then Rep. McKinney asked, “who was in charge of managing those wargames?,” and was cut off by Rep. Duncan Hunter. Gen. Myers never gave a name, but he did say, “North American Aerospace Defense Command was responsible.” She was promised an answer in writing and as far as I know, never received it.