The Two Party System is an Illusion....

[Zoo]

I have been awake since I was 18 yrs old, I'm 36 now. I started speaking out against both Democrats and Republicans since then and still do to day. I get more crap from that than for being a felon( got four years in prison for one ounce of marijuana). So year after year you hear the same crap it's the Republicans fault or it's the Demarcates fault. The system now days is set up to keep American citizens fighting each other while they(both Dem & Rep) get rich from corporations. They both belong to the greed party and this party is taking everything from us while we fight like little kids of which is better Coke or Pepsi. They are both soda no matter how you look at it and soda has nor will ever be good for you. This goes for the two party system. I always vote for a true independent(not some Dem or Rep acting like one) not matter what if one is not their I write one in. We as American's are doing the same thing over and over the same way and expecting a different out come!!1 

[SCH-120070C4]

I feel the same way as you. I've really been awake to whats happening for about the past year and half. I used to not care about politics because I always viewed it as being boring because of the way mainstream media talks about it. Once I learned the truth and did my own research I now question everything the government does and I'm quite disgusted. Once I learned how the government really works I feel like I'm living in a cartoon and nothing seems real. I no longer have the same out look on life and don't view everything as being OK like most people.

[Zoo]

I feel the same way as you. I've really been awake to whats happening for about the past year and half. I used to not care about politics because I always viewed it as being boring because of the way mainstream media talks about it. Once I learned the truth and did my own research I now question everything the government does and I'm quite disgusted. Once I learned how the government really works I feel like I'm living in a cartoon and nothing seems real. I no longer have the same out look on life and don't view everything as being OK like most people.

Now that you are awake it is impossible to go back to sleep no matter how hard you try. Which is a pain in the ass at times, trust me I know. People want the truth until it destroys their happy little world. They will fight to keep this illusion of their happy little world, for it's all they have or know. I found out over the years people do better when they think they find out on their own instead of forcing it down their throat. Do you find it the same way or you more in the face?!!1
 

[SCH-120070C4]

I have always thought the government was a bunch of BS and never really trusted them. It first just started out as me being curious about past events and presidents then you learn about one lie and then start questioning everything else. At first its really depressing to think about this stuff but I knew it would not go away by simply ignoring it so I learned more and more. I've learned so many things now and have been awake for awhile that it doesn't bother me any more other than pissing me off. I used to be scared for the future everyday and I still am but now I'm just calm and acclimated to corruption.

[Zoo]

Well your not alone, their are a ton of net works out their where like mind people are forming. Some are more ground orientated others are more net. So keep waking up others and remember to question everything.
http://youtu.be/Z6xaBYUlDYw!!1   

[Sambo]

Some sort of proportional representation system like New Zealand has would do some good, and a tighter leash on lobbyists could help.

[b_dubb]

campaign finance reform, ending corporate citizenship and term limits

any questions?

[Quick Karl]

You can never become the President of the United States without being a criminal. Same for the Senate and the Congress.

Q. Who voted for them?

[DanTSX]

Goatse is an illusion

[Unquenchable Angst]

In my state there are enough people that will sign petitions to get Greens, Constitutional, Libertarian ~~~~candidates on ballots. Why not (at least) move to petition  'None of the Above' on the ballots  and get out the people who don't vote. Might be good to to let the demorepublicrats  know people rather not have the lesser of two evils .
After all what have we got , people pissed at the high weirdness and crap of the Neo-CONvicts and elect someone who never seems to know what has happened around him .I mean to say it is obvious to me that no one since Kennedy has really worked for the greater good  and all seem to be the puppets of some dark force. Even Reagan was different enough to have an attempted assassination .After all the people that run the GOP did not and do not support conservatives(True Conservatives). They set the wolves on conservatives or pull support off conservatives all the time. Neo-cons are not conservatives  they are CFR operatives as are many of the Democrat operatives. , Both parties work toward creating crises and then taking stupid measures to correct the problems(crises) they create. Hegelian Dialectic operatives.
Government is a con to take your livelihood and squander it .Putting you in debt, your children in debt and their children in debt. Debt is slavery. Grand scheme to bail out the economy ,re build the infrastructure and all they told us all went to banks and financiers and rather than financing projects they gave bonuses to the very people that created the financial crises In the first place. Even local politics down to city and counties are corrupt. In my county we have seven districts and each ,each district has a school board and each has a director paid 175,000 per year ,7 of them in a county with 75,000 people.
People are being played divide and conquer. Really all the same deal in the Media they are all owned by elite CFR operatives whether right or left. You have to be open to all to be able to tell shit from shinola.
I think if a meteor hit DC like the one that zapped Siberia recently but actually hit smack dab in the middle of Pennsylvania Avenue would be a blessing to the nation and allow us to create a nation that lives up to its ideals. A real flush the turds down the cosmic toilet event and no way to blame anyone on earth or start a war over it. K street lobbyists and skanky dealer-doos gone, Government gone. Babylonian-Egyptian crypto-cultic mumbo-jumbo vaporized, Military-Industrial-corporado control vaporized. All the Neo Roman empire symbology vaporized.

[PB the Deplorable]

In my state there are enough people that will sign petitions to get Greens, Constitutional, Libertarian ~~~~candidates on ballots. Why not (at least) move to petition  'None of the Above' on the ballots  and get out the people who don't vote. Might be good to to let the demorepublicrats  know people rather not have the lesser of two evils .
After all what have we got , people pissed at the high weirdness and crap of the Neo-CONvicts and elect someone who never seems to know what has happened around him .I mean to say it is obvious to me that no one since Kennedy has really worked for the greater good  and all seem to be the puppets of some dark force. Even Reagan was different enough to have an attempted assassination .After all the people that run the GOP did not and do not support conservatives(True Conservatives). They set the wolves on conservatives or pull support off conservatives all the time. Neo-cons are not conservatives  they are CFR operatives as are many of the Democrat operatives. , Both parties work toward creating crises and then taking stupid measures to correct the problems(crises) they create. Hegelian Dialectic operatives.
Government is a con to take your livelihood and squander it .Putting you in debt, your children in debt and their children in debt. Debt is slavery. Grand scheme to bail out the economy ,re build the infrastructure and all they told us all went to banks and financiers and rather than financing projects they gave bonuses to the very people that created the financial crises In the first place. Even local politics down to city and counties are corrupt. In my county we have seven districts and each ,each district has a school board and each has a director paid 175,000 per year ,7 of them in a county with 75,000 people.
People are being played divide and conquer. Really all the same deal in the Media they are all owned by elite CFR operatives whether right or left. You have to be open to all to be able to tell shit from shinola.

I agree with much of this.  The answer is to eliminate many if not most government jobs and many if not most government agencies.  To cut way back on what they do.

A smaller government is a more responsive government.  It would do a much better job on the few specific tasks they are hired to do.  It simply would not have the power or funds to hand out goodies to their cronies in exchange for campaign finance bribes.

This is the only way to get back to something resembling 'government service'.  What we have now are people enriching themselves with money and power at our expense.

[Quick Karl]

In my state there are enough people that will sign petitions to get Greens, Constitutional, Libertarian ~~~~candidates on ballots. Why not (at least) move to petition  'None of the Above' on the ballots  and get out the people who don't vote. Might be good to to let the demorepublicrats  know people rather not have the lesser of two evils .
After all what have we got , people pissed at the high weirdness and crap of the Neo-CONvicts and elect someone who never seems to know what has happened around him .I mean to say it is obvious to me that no one since Kennedy has really worked for the greater good  and all seem to be the puppets of some dark force. Even Reagan was different enough to have an attempted assassination .After all the people that run the GOP did not and do not support conservatives(True Conservatives). They set the wolves on conservatives or pull support off conservatives all the time. Neo-cons are not conservatives  they are CFR operatives as are many of the Democrat operatives. , Both parties work toward creating crises and then taking stupid measures to correct the problems(crises) they create. Hegelian Dialectic operatives.
Government is a con to take your livelihood and squander it .Putting you in debt, your children in debt and their children in debt. Debt is slavery. Grand scheme to bail out the economy ,re build the infrastructure and all they told us all went to banks and financiers and rather than financing projects they gave bonuses to the very people that created the financial crises In the first place. Even local politics down to city and counties are corrupt. In my county we have seven districts and each ,each district has a school board and each has a director paid 175,000 per year ,7 of them in a county with 75,000 people.
People are being played divide and conquer. Really all the same deal in the Media they are all owned by elite CFR operatives whether right or left. You have to be open to all to be able to tell shit from shinola.
I think if a meteor hit DC like the one that zapped Siberia recently but actually hit smack dab in the middle of Pennsylvania Avenue would be a blessing to the nation and allow us to create a nation that lives up to its ideals. A real flush the turds down the cosmic toilet event and no way to blame anyone on earth or start a war over it. K street lobbyists and skanky dealer-doos gone, Government gone. Babylonian-Egyptian crypto-cultic mumbo-jumbo vaporized, Military-Industrial-corporado control vaporized. All the Neo Roman empire symbology vaporized.

I want to buy you a drink, sir.

[Designx]

I agree there's little distinction between the two main political parties in action (not words) but I will say the fringe end of both parties represent very different ideas from each other. It seems you have those in it for the money (the majority), and those in it for the manipulative power of laws and ideas (the fringe).

[Unquenchable Angst]

Amen PB<ZOO<SCH<QKarl
do nothing money suck jobs like Departments of Energy, Education, Homeland Security,
I don't remember what FDA, USDA are under but they are both controlled by Chemical(OIL), corporate Ag. and pharmaceutical corporations that the were formed to regulate. IRS as they constantly get into their gestapo mode whether empowered as thus or they chronically usurp powers they deserve jail time for. Federal Reserve  needs to be recognized as a branch of the Rothschild banking cartel and shut down. Money needs to be controlled by Treasury and House of Representatives as constitutionally mandated. Treasury has to be refrained from hiring secretaries from wall street firms and those people should only be allowed their views via congressional hearings. No More corporate revolving doors.No more bills writtain by lobbyists. No more inside trading allowed by government officials.
Oh Hell! I go back to my wish for a cosmic solution. Meteoric and swift justice. Karmic balance.lol.

[Unquenchable Angst]

Thank you Karl. With that I am having my last little dram of Battlehill Malt and imagining that you poured my libation. I toast you all gentleman .
Earlier tonight  I did some survey that was actually asking questions about things pertanate to beliefs and attitudes concerning the fate of our collective lives as citizens of a country with a future to what we have now . and there was one where they asked whether I supported supplying rubbers to school kids. They asked whether you would change your mind for money or nothing or never under any circumstances. It was the only one I put my price to be for it at $! mill There was no way to have any other way but yes or no. At the end of it they asked what I would do with the $1 million and I aid buy an ocean capable boat and stock it with all my needs and leave to find a place where I did not have to witness the decay of civilization from.
I do not think on the surface that government should be involved in using tax money for or involved in reproduction or any manner tax money to planned parenthood. I am not against choice but I am against the public coffer . Let individuals donate to their causes but not the government.

[Gd5150]

Massive term limits along with freezing any politicians wealth. No more than 10 years in office period. Being a politician is not meant to be a career. The US Senate is by far the most corrupt group in govt. at least the president is under a magnifine glass and out in 8 years. 30 40 50 yeAr senators is absolutely outrageous. And magically they're all worth 100s of millions, gee how'd that happen.

There is a way to go back to sleep once you've woken up. Stop reading and watching the news. It's all propaganda.

[PB the Deplorable]

Massive term limits along with freezing any politicians wealth. No more than 10 years in office period. Being a politician is not meant to be a career. The US Senate is by far the most corrupt group in govt. at least the president is under a magnifine glass and out in 8 years. 30 40 50 yeAr senators is absolutely outrageous. And magically they're all worth 100s of millions, gee how'd that happen.

There is a way to go back to sleep once you've woken up. Stop reading and watching the news. It's all propaganda.

The Federal government was meant to be small and have relatively little power.  Mst government action was to be at the state level.  The Federal government was set up to collectively do what the individual states were less able to on their own - have a national army, speak with one voice to the rest of the world (diplomacy), set the rules for commerce between the states, manage a common currency, establish federal courts as the final arbiter on Constitutional issues.

Power was spread as much as possible - split up between the House, the Senate, the judiciary, the President, the states, the individual.  New legislation was meant to move slowly and only after a wide consensus.

The Senate represented the individual states at the Federal level.  Senators were appointed by state legislatures.  The intent was no legislation would be passed that usurped power from the states and granted it to the Federal government.

That all ended in 1913 with the 17th Amendment.  Senators from then on were elected directly by the people and the states role in the Federal government was cut out entirely.

Not only was the Senate instantly useless - there already was a body representing the people directly (the House) - but that Amendment destroyed the carefully constructed balance of power, and power began to be concentrated at the Federal level in DC.  As of now, there are no constraints on the Federal government whatsoever.

[Yorkshire pud]

That all ended in 1913 with the 17th Amendment.  Senators from then on were elected directly by the people and the states role in the Federal government was cut out entirely.

I guess that's what happens when decisions are made for their time with no foresight to what might be more suitable or relevant a hundred years later...Still, it isn't commonplace.

[PB the Deplorable]

I guess that's what happens when decisions are made for their time with no foresight to what might be more suitable or relevant a hundred years later...Still, it isn't commonplace.

That's why there is a provision for making Amendments. 

But that Amendment was unwise and destructive.  As was the whole Woodrow Wilson era - we also got the Income Tax, the Fed, Prohibition, and entry into WWI

[Juan]

While a lot of people on these political threads are concerned about government or corporations, I'm much more concerned by the people who move easily between the groups to their own individual financial enrichment.  One idea is to impose a 50% federal income tax on post government incomes on people who move to an industry he or she once regulated.

[wr250]

campaign finance reform, ending corporate citizenship and term limits

any questions?

yes.
since congress will never do this (it would be to their personal detriment financially), a constitution convention will need to be held by the states, and amendments forced down the federal govt's throat.
and the question is: will the states do that?

[Yorkshire pud]

yes.
since congress will never do this (it would be to their personal detriment financially), a constitution convention will need to be held by the states, and amendments forced down the federal govt's throat.
and the question is: will the states do that?

The way to find out is to make a petition to get a referendum up, and have it voted on. Then ask a simple yes/no in the question. Then the winner can be decided by simple majority of the votes cast.

[Grov505th]

yes.
since congress will never do this (it would be to their personal detriment financially), a constitution convention will need to be held by the states, and amendments forced down the federal govt's throat.
and the question is: will the states do that?

I doubt it, most of the folks in the state government see it as a stepping stone to a Fed  seat and most are rich anyways.
I hate say it, but unless something drastic happens nothing is going to change.
If you dont have the money you cant run. Just look at what happend in VA Governers race.

[Mind Flayer Monk]

Well your not alone, their are a ton of net works out their where like mind people are forming. Some are more ground orientated others are more net. So keep waking up others and remember to question everything.

I liked the video, and the Jacque Fresco commentary at the end of the video. I think you might like some of the writings of Elia Kazan and Alfred Kazin.

[Zoo]

I liked the video, and the Jacque Fresco commentary at the end of the video. I think you might like some of the writings of Elia Kazan and Alfred Kazin.

Glad you did.. I have heard of both men the first was a director if not mistaken and the second is a writer if memory serves me right. I will in fact look more into it as I truly don't know!!1

[Zoo]

Here is a little fun fact we as a FREE NATION incarcerate more people than any other country. That's right we as FREE AMERICANS imprison more of are people than any other country. WOW right? Not even close we also as Americans are eight times more likely to be killed by a Peace Officer(cop) than from a Terrorist. "  Eric Holder", Barack Obama’s attorney-general, declared that America has an “unnecessarily large prison population” (http://www.economist.com/news/united-states/21583701-america-waking-up-cost-mass-incarceration-unlikely-alliance-left-and). That is putting it mildly. The Land of the Free has 5% of the world’s population, but 25% of its prisoners. In all, about 2.2m Americans fester behind bars: one in every 107 adults. www.economist.com/.../21583680-eric-holders-ideas-locking-up-fewer-. I know how you all like facts. So why do we do this? How are we going to change it? Does any one really care? Thank god we have the two party system taking care of it for us-About 10,000 people in the United States may be wrongfully convicted of serious crimes each year, a new study suggests.The results are based on a survey of 188 judges, prosecuting attorneys, public defenders, sheriffs and police
chiefs in Ohio and 41 state attorneys general. http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/ronhuff.htm Just some fun facts from a FREE COUNTRY!!1

[Quick Karl]

Here is a little fun fact we as a FREE NATION incarcerate more people than any other country. That's right we as FREE AMERICANS imprison more of are people than any other country. WOW right? Not even close we also as Americans are eight times more likely to be killed by a Peace Officer(cop) than from a Terrorist. "  Eric Holder", Barack Obama’s attorney-general, declared that America has an “unnecessarily large prison population” (http://www.economist.com/news/united-states/21583701-america-waking-up-cost-mass-incarceration-unlikely-alliance-left-and). That is putting it mildly. The Land of the Free has 5% of the world’s population, but 25% of its prisoners. In all, about 2.2m Americans fester behind bars: one in every 107 adults. www.economist.com/.../21583680-eric-holders-ideas-locking-up-fewer-. I know how you all like facts. So why do we do this? How are we going to change it? Does any one really care? Thank god we have the two party system taking care of it for us-About 10,000 people in the United States may be wrongfully convicted of serious crimes each year, a new study suggests.The results are based on a survey of 188 judges, prosecuting attorneys, public defenders, sheriffs and police
chiefs in Ohio and 41 state attorneys general. http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/ronhuff.htm Just some fun facts from a FREE COUNTRY!!1

That should give you a clue; how many homicidal maniacs and spree-killers are out roaming the streets in the rest of the world, instead of being locked up where they belong?

[Yorkshire pud]

Here is a little fun fact we as a FREE NATION incarcerate more people than any other country. That's right we as FREE AMERICANS imprison more of are people than any other country. WOW right? Not even close we also as Americans are eight times more likely to be killed by a Peace Officer(cop) than from a Terrorist. "  Eric Holder", Barack Obama’s attorney-general, declared that America has an “unnecessarily large prison population” (http://www.economist.com/news/united-states/21583701-america-waking-up-cost-mass-incarceration-unlikely-alliance-left-and). That is putting it mildly. The Land of the Free has 5% of the world’s population, but 25% of its prisoners. In all, about 2.2m Americans fester behind bars: one in every 107 adults. www.economist.com/.../21583680-eric-holders-ideas-locking-up-fewer-. I know how you all like facts. So why do we do this? How are we going to change it? Does any one really care? Thank god we have the two party system taking care of it for us-About 10,000 people in the United States may be wrongfully convicted of serious crimes each year, a new study suggests.The results are based on a survey of 188 judges, prosecuting attorneys, public defenders, sheriffs and police
chiefs in Ohio and 41 state attorneys general. http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/ronhuff.htm Just some fun facts from a FREE COUNTRY!!1

I'm taking a real way out guess here; Money?

A lot of your prisons are privately owned aren't they? They make money from incarceration. They also make money from various 'programs' that just happen to extend incarceration. It's little to do with punishment for misdeeds or reforming the character (where possible); it's to do with money. Court cases get dragged on and on..appeals drag on for years and years.. Lawyers make a heap of money...everyone's a winner! Except of course the notion of fair justice..Hey, don't worry, you're not alone, it's heading this way too; only when our government has peace meal privitised the incarceration/probation/prisoner transfer side of it, the companies who work for profit, had the brain wave and put names on the tagging list who were in prison or in some cases, dead.. Still, we all make mistakes eh?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/supportservices/10460650/Government-refuses-G4Ss-24.1m-for-wrong-tagging-bills.html

[Yorkshire pud]

That should give you a clue; how many homicidal maniacs and spree-killers are out roaming the streets in the rest of the world, instead of being locked up where they belong?

You tell us? But it's a bit strawman anyway; you have the highest murder rate in the western world, so clearly you're locking up the wrong people, or your police and justice system is woefully inadequate.

[PB the Deplorable]

They have the right people locked up.  There are a lot more that belong there.