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awesome video about media bias

Started by The General, August 14, 2012, 11:46:13 AM


Zircon

General, I'm probably not the first to do so but, thank you very, very much for this link. It is quite informative and all of us benefit from this post and its revealing content.

onan

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/11/09/1034724/-Limbaugh-Admits-Conservative-Bias-of-Media-Updated-Transcript

WED NOV 09, 2011 AT 10:07 AM PST
Limbaugh Admits Conservative Bias of Media (Updated Transcript)

QuoteA few minutes ago on his radio show, Rush Limbaugh finally came out and admitted the conservative bias of the mainstream media in America. It came when Rush was complaining about the difficulty in finding liberal soundbites to play and ridicule on his show. Rush declared, “If it weren't for MSNBC, there wouldn't be any liberal soundbites.”

Limbaugh said that he hates MSNBC and wanted to tell his employees to ban clips from the network on his show. But he realized that he couldn't do that because MSNBC was the only media outlet where he could get liberal soundbites. (He admitted that “Al Gore's network” has them, too, but apparently Rush doesn't want Current TV to get any attention.)

Furthermore, Limbaugh admitted that most of MSNBC's programming didn't reflect any liberal viewpoint: “MSNBC's it....And it's two shows, three shows.” Interestingly, among these few shows with liberal viewpoints allowed that Limbaugh identified was Morning Joe, the show named for host (and former Republican Congressman) Joe Scarborough.

For years, as I note in my book, The Most Dangerous Man in America: Rush Limbaugh's Assault on Reason , Limbaugh and other conservatives have promoted the myth of the liberal media in America. Now, Limbaugh has finally confessed the truth: liberal views are so isolated in the corporate press that the only places he can find liberal views in the mainstream broadcast media are a few shows on one cable news network. It's proof that there isn't a liberal bias in the media.

I remember in the campaigns of Obama and McCain, Palin getting 3 times the coverage Biden did.

As to PragerU I have a few concerns about the "facts" presented in the video. How did one find the center point on liberal and conservative with respect to the common man being dead center? Center of what? America compared to all other industrialized countries is far more right leaning.

Are more journalists left leaning? from what I have read... yes. But the editors and publishers that have final say in what hits our eyes and ears. Those two factors are more right leaning. Does it balance? I dunno.

I will say that the media misses a bunch on both sides of the fence. And more often than not because Americans aren't interested in stories that are "uncomfortable" unless it is gay or a blow job... perhaps that is redundant.

General, you know I respect your point of view. And I think the video is a good place to start a conversation. But not to reduce our media to a one side versus the other.









Eddie Coyle

 
       To quote William Butler Yeats, "the centre cannot hold".

             I used to believe in that 15/70/15 split. I don't anymore and I'm seeing the divisions becoming clearer everyday. At a family outing the other day, politics(Ryan's selection as VP in particular) were the cause of quite a few "animated" conversations and resultant bad feelings. And quite of a few of these people were formerly "Reagan Democrats" who voted for Republicans (in national elections) frequently. Not anymore. Personally, I'm a cafeteria voter, I pick certain issues. No party, no candidate can ever count on me. It's fluid, my views can evolve(or devolve)

          Is the media biased? Almost certainly...but in this day and age, people tend to pick and choose the media they get their information from, there are innumerable alternatives. The days of Walter Cronkite are gone. Keith Olbermann just learned this the hard way. Only a masochist would watch Chris Matthews or Sean Hannity to be annoyed by them.

      And much of the media is based in the Northeast, particularly the DC to Boston crowd, and it's various institutions of higher learning. They're inherently left-leaning. Geography, educational background, religious background...all factors in media bias. The media is hardly a tableau representing an acccurate demographic landscape of the USA.

   
     

slipstream

Quote from: Eddie Coyle on August 14, 2012, 01:56:24 PM

       To quote William Butler Yeats, "the centre cannot hold".

             I used to believe in that 15/70/15 split. I don't anymore and I'm seeing the divisions becoming clearer everyday. At a family outing the other day, politics(Ryan's selection as VP in particular) were the cause of quite a few "animated" conversations and resultant bad feelings. And quite of a few of these people were formerly "Reagan Democrats" who voted for Republicans (in national elections) frequently. Not anymore. Personally, I'm a cafeteria voter, I pick certain issues. No party, no candidate can ever count on me. It's fluid, my views can evolve(or devolve)

          Is the media biased? Almost certainly...but in this day and age, people tend to pick and choose the media they get their information from, there are innumerable alternatives. The days of Walter Cronkite are gone. Keith Olbermann just learned this the hard way. Only a masochist would watch Chris Matthews or Sean Hannity to be annoyed them.

   


The study as presented in the video confirms what we all pretty well knew.  But remember there is a difference between commentary and news reporting.  Of course commentary will be biased, but what we expect and don't get are objective news reports, or we get news reports that wander into commentary.

analog kid

All media is biased of course, but most of the other stuff this guy is slinging is highly specious.

And what is this "Prager University?" I keep seeing right wingers link to it on facebook, but without any explanation of what a person is supposed to make of it.

Eddie Coyle

Quote from: analog kid on August 14, 2012, 02:54:39 PM


And what is this "Prager University?" I keep seeing right wingers link to it on facebook, but without any explanation of what a person is supposed to make of it.
Dennis Prager, rightist talk show host. Used to have syndicated TV show circa 1995. Kind of "biased" towards conservatism :D

analog kid

Quote from: Eddie Coyle on August 14, 2012, 02:57:39 PM
       Dennis Prager, rightist talk show host. Used to have syndicated TV show circa 1995. Kind of "biased" towards conservatism :D

Kind of???

The General

Quote from: Eddie Coyle on August 14, 2012, 02:57:39 PM
       Dennis Prager, rightist talk show host. Used to have syndicated TV show circa 1995. Kind of "biased" towards conservatism :D
Which he readily admits.  I don't care if a media outlet is biased.  What bothers me is when they don't admit it.  Rush, Hannity, Savage, Prager, etc...... they all admit it.  It's their whole program.  Chris Matthews, on the other hand, claims to be a centrist.  He's obviously not.

Eddie Coyle

Quote from: analog kid on August 14, 2012, 03:30:30 PM
Kind of???
Sarcasm doesn't always translate in print. But that's what it was.

Eddie Coyle

Quote from: The General on August 14, 2012, 03:36:57 PM
Which he readily admits.  I don't care if a media outlet is biased.  What bothers me is when they don't admit it.  Rush, Hannity, Savage, Prager, etc...... they all admit it.  It's their whole program.  Chris Matthews, on the other hand, claims to be a centrist.  He's obviously not.

     Matthews is certifiable when he claims that, if he thinks he'a centrist then he's really delusional. Nobody with a slightest bit of objectivity accepts that. Actually, his TV show has effectively destroyed his credibility. He's a lifelong Democratic operative, that's well-known...but he was once an adequate,albeit obviously left leaning political commentator(we're talking 20 years ago) but the rigors of a nightly show have made him a caricature.

McPhallus

Quote from: Eddie Coyle on August 14, 2012, 01:56:24 PM

       To quote William Butler Yeats, "the centre cannot hold".

             I used to believe in that 15/70/15 split. I don't anymore and I'm seeing the divisions becoming clearer everyday. At a family outing the other day, politics(Ryan's selection as VP in particular) were the cause of quite a few "animated" conversations and resultant bad feelings. And quite of a few of these people were formerly "Reagan Democrats" who voted for Republicans (in national elections) frequently. Not anymore. Personally, I'm a cafeteria voter, I pick certain issues. No party, no candidate can ever count on me. It's fluid, my views can evolve

I'm surprised that you vote at all, what with your cynicism. I've been a member of the Fuck 'em All Party since 2008.

The General

Quote from: onan on August 14, 2012, 01:26:26 PM

WED NOV 09, 2011 AT 10:07 AM PST
Limbaugh Admits Conservative Bias of Media (Updated Transcript)
Consider the source. 
Obviously Rush was either being sarcastic or making some other larger point that they missed.  There's no way that Rush Limbaugh thinks mainstream media has a homogeneous conservative bias outside of 2 shows on MSNBC.

Quote from: onan on August 14, 2012, 01:26:26 PM

I remember in the campaigns of Obama and McCain, Palin getting 3 times the coverage Biden did.
Yeah, negative coverage.

Quote from: onan on August 14, 2012, 01:26:26 PM
As to PragerU I have a few concerns about the "facts" presented in the video. How did one find the center point on liberal and conservative with respect to the common man being dead center? Center of what? America compared to all other industrialized countries is far more right leaning.
I don't know.  The guy on the video is not Prager, it is UCLA Professor of Political Science and Economics, Tim Groseclose.  I guess one would have to read his book to answer your questions.

Quote from: onan on August 14, 2012, 01:26:26 PM
Are more journalists left leaning? from what I have read... yes. But the editors and publishers that have final say in what hits our eyes and ears. Those two factors are more right leaning. Does it balance? I dunno.

I will say that the media misses a bunch on both sides of the fence. And more often than not because Americans aren't interested in stories that are "uncomfortable" unless it is gay or a blow job... perhaps that is redundant.

General, you know I respect your point of view. And I think the video is a good place to start a conversation. But not to reduce our media to a one side versus the other.
Being conservative myself, it all seems left leaning to me.  To a left winger, it would seem different, I'm sure.  If you lean left, and you feel like the media is generally fair and centrist, you might consider your point of view.

Eddie Coyle

Quote from: McPhallus on August 14, 2012, 03:54:02 PM
I'm surprised that you vote at all, what with your cynicism. I've been a member of the Fuck 'em All Party since 2008.
And not to mention my agoraphobia, misanthropy and apathy. I do vote on occasion, but I'm hardly reliable or enthusiastic. I'm undoubtedly sitting out the Presidential election...which Obama will win easily.
       Local elections are a different animal. And it's selfish...but I have neighbors or relatives I feel I have to vote for, especially if you want something in return(like keeping your kid from getting placed in shitty school etc)

Quote from: onan on August 14, 2012, 01:26:26 PM
WED NOV 09, 2011 AT 10:07 AM PST
Limbaugh Admits Conservative Bias of Media (Updated Transcript)

...  Rush was complaining about the difficulty in finding liberal soundbites to play and ridicule on his show. Rush declared, “If it weren't for MSNBC, there wouldn't be any liberal soundbites.”...

The title to this artilce is the typical misleading - Rush didn't 'admit' any such thing. 

These days with easy recording and internet access to their broadcasts, perhaps they (the media) have gotten a little more savvy, they've realized the talk shows playing all those clips the next day finally exposed them and they don't set themselves up as easily anymore.. 

Most of  the bias is in what they don't cover.  That's why it's so important for the Democrats to constantly demonize talk radio and Fox news - they don't want people getting access to both sides.


Quote from: onan on August 14, 2012, 01:26:26 PM
... I remember in the campaigns of Obama and McCain, Palin getting 3 times the coverage Biden did...

So that people wouldn't see for themselves what an idiot Biden is and to smear and ridicule Palin?

analog kid

Fox News is a frightening hellscape of Republican bias and misinformation. I don't know of an equivalent to it on the left.

The General

Quote from: analog kid on August 14, 2012, 04:27:02 PM
Fox News is a frightening hellscape of Republican bias and misinformation. I don't know of an equivalent to it on the left.
NPR?  MSNBC?  The New York Times? 

Quote from: analog kid on August 14, 2012, 04:27:02 PM
Fox News is a frightening hellscape of Republican bias and misinformation. I don't know of an equivalent to it on the left.

Disclosure - I haven't watched any TV 'news' or political discussion shows for years, no Fox news, no Fox commentary shows.  Maybe a few minutes of local topics if I get sucked in by the teasers.  But the way I hear Fox denounced by people I disagree with completely, I figure they must be doing something right.

I do see and hear some of the clips sometimes.  And read and hear about some of what goes on.  One way for the main stream media to start getting market share back is to start being a little more honest and at least try to cover things fairly.  Don't see that happening though as they are proud members of the D party coalition, if not wholly owned subsidiaries.  It's funny when they talk about right wing bias - that is usually just Rush and others playing back what they themselves have said and reporting how they've covered things.

Juan

I spent 25-years in TV newsrooms - local stations.  I'd say the large majority of news people leaned left, but only leaned.  What got them in trouble with bias was that they have very little contact with people outside the newsroom.  Once an idea takes hold, it's hard to dislodge.  For instance, I'd bet they would be very surprised to learn Obamacare cut Medicare.

As for top management, they are all the same smarmy, lying, say anything managers most businesses have. 

BTW, the chief function of a News Director is to keep sales and management people out of the newsroom. 

Quote from: analog kid on August 14, 2012, 04:27:02 PM
Fox News is a frightening hellscape of Republican bias and misinformation. I don't know of an equivalent to it on the left.

Where does Bill Maher calling Sarah Palin a c**t  fall on the scale?   He's a fairly prominent person, how did that get covered?

Or how about the Obama campaign surrogates saying Romney is a felon, doesn't pay taxes, is responsible for that lady dying of cancer, or just today Biden telling a group of blacks Romney wants to 'put 'em back in chains' - how does all that get reported by the MSM?  Any 'bias and misinformation' going on there?  This is all pure toxic waste.  No equivalent on the left?  It's been going on so long people are numb to it and it just blends into the background with little notice or comment t all.   

analog kid

Quote from: Paper*Boy on August 14, 2012, 06:21:50 PM

Where does Bill Maher calling Sarah Palin a c**t  fall on the scale?   He's a fairly prominent person, how did that get covered?

Or how about the Obama campaign surrogates saying Romney is a felon, doesn't pay taxes, is responsible for that lady dying of cancer, or just today Biden telling a group of blacks Romney wants to 'put 'em back in chains' - how does all that get reported by the MSM?  Any 'bias and misinformation' going on there?  This is all pure toxic waste.  No equivalent on the left?  It's been going on so long people are numb to it and it just blends into the background with little notice or comment t all.

Bill Maher is a comedian. That may sound like a copout, but how is a comedian telling a joke in his monologue equivilent to a news orginization lying to its viewer? The rest of that are red herrings. If you can study that Fox News image carefully and not see a vast difference between their news and any other outlet in existence, then I don't know what to say. The right can't seem to fathom just how far down the rabbit hole they've gone.

b_dubb

Quote from: The General on August 14, 2012, 05:43:25 PM
NPR?  MSNBC?  The New York Times?


i don't know that any of these organizations actively mislead their readers.  roger ailes encouraged fox news 'reporters' to do just that. 


bias?  yes.  actively involved in deception?  only on fox news

onan

I did a bit of research on NPR about 6 years ago. I wasn't surprised to learn that:

QuoteRepublicans not only had a substantial partisan edge, individual Republicans were NPR’s most popular sources overall, taking the top seven spots in frequency of appearance. George Bush led all sources for the month with 36 appearances, followed by Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld ( 8 ) and Sen. Pat Roberts (6). Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, Secretary of State Colin Powell, White House press secretary Ari Fleischer and Iraq proconsul Paul Bremer all tied with five appearances each.


Quote... little evidence has ever been presented for a left bias at NPR, and FAIR’s latest study gives it no support. Looking at partisan sourcesâ€"including government officials, party officials, campaign workers and consultantsâ€"Republicans outnumbered Democrats by more than 3 to 2 (61 percent to 38 percent). A majority of Republican sources when the GOP controls the White House and Congress may not be surprising, but Republicans held a similar though slightly smaller edge (57 percent to 42 percent) in 1993, when Clinton was president and Democrats controlled both houses of Congress. And a lively race for the Democratic presidential nomination was beginning to heat up at the time of the 2003 study.


My post just prior to this one was argued by suggesting my source should be considered but the original post, presented from "PragerU" wasn't asked for the same consideration.

I will quickly admit MSNBC did a horrible thing by editing the Zimmerman 911 call. Fox news does that shit daily.

Quote from: onan on August 14, 2012, 07:52:58 PM
I did a bit of research on NPR about 6 years ago. I wasn't surprised to learn that:






The research presented in Prager U is from a study done 2003-2005. So 6 years ago at NPR would have been after that.

Groseclose has an interesting website thats worth reading no matter what your political orientation.
http://www.timgroseclose.com/

Another piece/podcast on him from freakonomics radio.
http://www.freakonomics.com/tag/tim-groseclose/

Some criticisms
http://andrewgelman.com/2011/07/confusion-about-rigging-the-numbers-the-support-of-ideological-opposites-whos-a-501c3-and-the-asymmetry-of-media-bias/

http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2006/01/b1347483.html


Virtual

Essentially this video is from a biased source. He says something is a FACT but never backs up his fact sources. This video is an opinion... Know who your sources are, why they are saying what they say and for what agenda. Never take a persons word something is a fact.

Quote from Wikipedia "Dennis Prager, national lecturer and author of Happiness is a Serious Problem and Still the Best Hope, conceptualized and structured the organization in 2008. A year later, Prager University officially debuted with the video "The American Trinity", taught by Prager. Allen Estrin, a Hollywood screenwriter and producer,[1] has helped produce about two dozen videos for the university. The University's mission statement claims it aims to create a better understanding and appreciation of the American Judeo-Christian value system by leveraging the viral power of the Internet. The university believes that citizens of a society should understand its founding values."

I will take Noam Chomsky "Manufacturing Consent" any day.

Virtual

Quote from: Mind Flayer Monk on August 14, 2012, 08:31:46 PM
The research presented in Prager U is from a study done 2003-2005. So 6 years ago at NPR would have been after that.

Thank you

l3urton

How many times has the LEFT WING MEDIA been caught  ummm changing up stories ? GOOGLE CBS lies. GOOGLE ABC lies. hows DAN rather doing ? oh please Rush admitted this... funny you  sit around trying to TAKE away rush credit and knocking him down BUT are really fast to  Name drop rush and use his words  on him. IF you knew much about Radio.  those clips are not  free. most places  wont give permission for use.  this is why he voices over reporters and lets you hear the guests. DUH. lol  But keep knocking the SAME guy you use for credit. THAT gives you MUCH more credibility. LOL 

Juan

One thing that has always disturbed me about NPR is that they do not disclose who pays them to do specific stories.  Yes, they do stories for grant money, and the grant specifies to a degree what the story will cover.  The grants do not tell NPR what to say or how to report, but they do slant coverage by specifying subject matter.

I think the listening public would be better served by a statement from NPR saying who provided the grant.

b_dubb

Quote from: l3urton on August 15, 2012, 04:12:32 AM
How many times has the LEFT WING MEDIA been caught  ummm changing up stories ? GOOGLE CBS lies. GOOGLE ABC lies. hows DAN rather doing ? oh please Rush admitted this... funny you  sit around trying to TAKE away rush credit and knocking him down BUT are really fast to  Name drop rush and use his words  on him. IF you knew much about Radio.  those clips are not  free. most places  wont give permission for use.  this is why he voices over reporters and lets you hear the guests. DUH. lol  But keep knocking the SAME guy you use for credit. THAT gives you MUCH more credibility. LOL
thank you for this response. it's well articulated and your use of ALL CAPS to emphasize certain points is masterful. 


Rush said what Rush said.  if he said that "if it weren't for MSNBC there wouldn't BE any Liberal sound bites", that should pretty much sum it up.  as in ... no need to read between the lines. 


btw - you can see that i have mastered use of  ... the elipsis.

MV/Liberace!

Quote from: b_dubb on August 14, 2012, 07:00:36 PM
bias?  yes.  actively involved in deception?  only on fox news


you really believe that?  only on fox?

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