Random Political Thoughts

[NowhereInTime]

Took you long enough to insert race into that post.  Perhaps a new record?

No, I just wanted to mock conservatives' indignation at "reverse racism".  As if that's a thing.

There must be a psychological reason for these 'Progressives' to need to insert race into every conversation.

Every conversation as pertains to conservatives, anyway.  Without the need to to constantly bolster your self esteem by constantly denigrating others as "inferior" or "takers", there wouldn't be the rampant racism and classism throughout history.   

As if they know they don't really have facts and common sense to back up their claims.

This, from the Assertion King?  The Clown Prince of "Reported"?  You've never substantiated any claim you've ever made here and, in fact have been successfully refuted by anyone who's ever challenged your claims.  Easily. 

It's straight out of Alinsky,

Yawn.

and I believe them when the say they've never heard of the guy - it's an indication of just how much they've been influenced by the America haters without even knowing it.

Yes, yes.  The Jedi Mind Trick.  Do go on...

As far as their crutch of inserting race into everything, there is something sick and disturbing about it.  It's certainly not helping race relations or solving any problems, just the opposite.

The lady doth protest too much, methinks...

That's weird, because the O-bot swooners spent most of their time during the campaign and the aftermath denying it. "He's not a Muslim', 'he's not a Muslim sympathizer', 'he's not a Marxist', 'he's not an America hating Leftist'.  'He just sat in Rev Wright's church for 20 years - he didn't hear it or agree with it'.   "When he said 'spread the wealth around' he didn't mean more Socialism''.  'When he said 'you didn't build that' he wasn't impugning entrepreneurs'.  When he talked about people 'clinging to their guns and religion' 'he wasn't dissing Americans and American culture'.  No, of course not.

No, these were examples of conservative demagoguery where you kept trying to make the "he's not like us" case.  And you want to feign indignance about being called out for race issues?

No, the America hating associates he ran with, from what little we knew about him, 'those were just acquaintances'.  Terrorist Bill Ayres was 'just a guy he knew from the neighborhood'.

See, it always gets back to this.  He "hates America".  Stupid.  You would think a guy who "hates America" could've seriously compromised this country by now (and please don't come back with Obamacare; that's just tedious) to the point where we are all learning Mandarin, or according to you, Arabic. 

Now we are told one said any of this before he got into office.

No, you are told that none of your concerns were true, and they aren't.

[PB the Deplorable]

Well, this..

... I personally am very aware of Saul Alinsky, and I don't know of a single person who loved his country more than he did...

.. goes a long way towards explaining this

Obama is a liberal, not a socialist, and a rather moderate liberal at that.

Are we at least in agreement regarding Alinsky's influence over the modern Progressive movement? 

And that getting Obama elected was their crowning achievement to date?

[136 or 142]

Well, this..

.. goes a long way towards explaining this



Are we at least in agreement regarding Alinsky's influence over the modern Progressive movement? 

And that getting Obama elected was their crowning achievement to date?

I have no idea what influence Saul Alinsky has on the modern Progressive movement, other than, as with the modern Conservative movement, there are at least a dozen components that make up the 'modern Progressive movement', some of which are likely more influenced than others.

Of course, some of those in the 'modern Conservative movement' are also influenced by Alinsky.

[VtaGeezer]

Well, this..

.. goes a long way towards explaining this



Are we at least in agreement regarding Alinsky's influence over the modern Progressive movement? 

And that getting Obama elected was their crowning achievement to date?

I suspect that you have no idea what Alinsky's views were beyond vaguely knowing he was a liberal, as pounded home by the Fox 2nd Raters who, along with Rabid Radio, plucked the guy from anonymity because his name sounded so threatening to Boomer WASPs.  Being an Alinsky was bad enough...but named SAUL!!  Jackpot!!!  No more's needed for the mouth breathers!! "With a with a name like that,  he's got to be one of those Trotskyites that Daddy used to warn us kids about!!"

Never mind that Alinsky's principal influence is mostly in methodology for political action, is basically non-denominational in adoption, and used by the right as well.  But if he'd been named Tom Jackson, his "influence" and name wouldn't strike terror the heart of right wingers.

[PB the Deplorable]

...  Being an Alinsky was bad enough...but named SAUL!!  Jackpot!!!  No more's needed for the mouth breathers!! "With a with a name like that,  he's got to be one of those Trotskyites that Daddy used to warn us kids about!!"...

Congrats, you beat Nit with the race baiting.  That's not easy

[PB the Deplorable]

Saul Alinsky's Rules For Radicals

1.“Power is not only what you have, but what the enemy thinks you have.” Power is derived from 2 main sources â€" money and people. “Have-Nots” must build power from flesh and blood.

2.“Never go outside the expertise of your people.” It results in confusion, fear and retreat. Feeling secure adds to the backbone of anyone.

3.“Whenever possible, go outside the expertise of the enemy.” Look for ways to increase insecurity, anxiety and uncertainty.

4.“Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.” If the rule is that every letter gets a reply, send 30,000 letters. You can kill them with this because no one can possibly obey all of their own rules.

5.“Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions.

6.“A good tactic is one your people enjoy.” They’ll keep doing it without urging and come back to do more. They’re doing their thing, and will even suggest better ones.

7.“A tactic that drags on too long becomes a drag.” Don’t become old news.

8.“Keep the pressure on. Never let up.” Keep trying new things to keep the opposition off balance. As the opposition masters one approach, hit them from the flank with something new.

9.“The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself.” Imagination and ego can dream up many more consequences than any activist.

10.“If you push a negative hard enough, it will push through and become a positive.” Violence from the other side can win the public to your side because the public sympathizes with the underdog.

11.“The price of a successful attack is a constructive alternative.” Never let the enemy score points because you’re caught without a solution to the problem.

12.“Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions



These are his 'rules', not mine.  Not people trying to smear him.

Just as every country is different, different culture, different values, different strengths and weaknesses, the path towards a Marxist Totalitarian State varies for different situations and countries.

Mao's tactics were different from Stalin's.  Which were different from Castro's.  Lenin and Trotsky and Marx himself had different flavors, ideas on how to seize power.  It's easier somewhere with grinding poverty, under a ruthless dictator.  It's more difficult in a prosperous free country.

Alinsky's tactics were tailored for the United States.  They showed the way on how to destabilize, then destroy our country by infiltrating our institutions, and through constant agitation.


Nowhere in his 'rules' does he mention convincing others with a better argument.  By telling the truth.  By making government more efficient.  By improving things through leadership, or by example.

No, it's all about 'the enemy', 'increasing insecurity, anxiety and uncertainty', 'ridicule', 'threat's, constant attack, provocation to the point of drawing a violent reaction.  The targets are everyone who doesn't agree with the Left, those who won't 'go along' with their schemes.  The goal is to silence them, to control public discourse unopposed.  It worked for years - infiltrate and finally control education, the media, the bureaucracy, and insist anyone opposed to any part of their agenda is somehow 'racist'.

That last part is so ingrained that the lefties here can't even post a comment without resorting to it.


Rule Number 12 is the best:  “Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions." 

Ring any bells?


Oh yeah, great guy.  Wonderful man.  He really just loved the country so much and was only trying to improve things

Except well meaning people don't resort to these sorts of cowardly bully tactics. 

By the way, if a person can read thru these 'rules' and not be startled to see the history of the Democrat Party and the 'Liberals' since about 1970, and - especially - the 'Progressives' and now Obama/Occupy/Ferguson, then they are way short on brain cells. 

[VtaGeezer]

Saul Alinsky's Rules For Radicals According to Glenn Beck....

Shocking stuff, eh?  But where's the ideology?  Change a noun here and there and some paraphrasing, and you have a good coach's pre-game pep talk.  Or the tenets of Breitbart.com, or the opening mantra of a Blaze staff meeting.  There are fundie televangelists using Alinsky.  I'd guess the NRA lobby staff uses it. But you can't see it, can you?  You're so lost in your dogma that you can't see Alinsky published an activist tool box for right or left.  The only difference is that if a right winger had written it, he'd have licensed it and set up a motivational consulting corporation.

[PB the Deplorable]

Shocking stuff, eh?  But where's the ideology?  Change a noun here and there and some paraphrasing, and you have a good coach's pre-game pep talk.  Or the tenets of Breitbart.com, or the opening mantra of a Blaze staff meeting.  There are fundie televangelists using Alinsky.  I'd guess the NRA lobby staff uses it. But you can't see it, can you?  You're so lost in your dogma that you can't see Alinsky published an activist tool box for right or left.  The only difference is that if a right winger had written it, he'd have licensed it and set up a motivational consulting corporation.

Where's the ideology?  It was clear to everyone who he was writing for.  Who's been using his 'rules' all these years.

You bet the rest of us caught on, and figured fair is fair and use them now too - or at least the least objectionable ones - for some reason we aren't tearing up our downtowns and attacking the police.

The difference between, say, Occupy and the NRA is the NRA is fighting to keep our rights, while Occupy is there to generate chaos, fear, hate, and confusion.

[136 or 142]

Where's the ideology?  It was clear to everyone who he was writing for.  Who's been using his 'rules' all these years.

You bet the rest of us caught on, and figured fair is fair and use them now too - or at least the least objectionable ones - for some reason we aren't tearing up our downtowns and attacking the police.

The difference between, say, Occupy and the NRA is the NRA is fighting to keep our rights, while Occupy is there to generate chaos, fear, hate, and confusion.

Already forgotten Cliven Bundy Man*Boy?

[VtaGeezer]

Where's the ideology?  It was clear to everyone who he was writing for.  Who's been using his 'rules' all these years.

You bet the rest of us caught on, and figured fair is fair and use them now too - or at least the least objectionable ones - for some reason we aren't tearing up our downtowns and attacking the police.

The difference between, say, Occupy and the NRA is the NRA is fighting to keep our rights, while Occupy is there to generate chaos, fear, hate, and confusion.

I sometimes wonder if you're not really a fringe liberal demonstrating how thick the thinking of the right really is when pushed into the light.  You do it so very well.

[136 or 142]

I sometimes wonder if you're not really a fringe liberal demonstrating how thick the thinking of the right really is when pushed into the light.  You do it so very well.

Actually, if you check the Rethuglic leaning sites Politico or The Hill or the avowed Rethuglic site Real Clear Politics (their polling aggregation is non partisan) or even Free Republic you'll find dozens of like non minded like Man*Boy all parroting the latest dittohead talking points, though rarely in such a comprehensive package as Man*Boy presents.

[3OctaveFart]

Alinsky was a sociopath who found a career suitable to his personality disorder. Nice work if you can find it.
You might say the president did the same thing, not having ever worked a real job in his life.

[136 or 142]

Alinsky was a sociopath who found a career suitable to his personality disorder. Nice work if you can find it.
You might say the president did the same thing, not having ever worked a real job in his life.

In addition to being a community organizer, which is most definately a real job, Obama was also a law professor (or lecturer if you insist, I've seen both) and a law firm Of Counsel.

Dumbya, on the other hand, never had a real job.  At least not one that he got by himself.

I don't know on what basis you would call Saul Alinsky a sociopath, but compared to the real sociopaths Dumbya, his Big Dick, the idiot Condilar, Wolfowitz, Rumsfailed, et al, Alinsky was a saint.

[3OctaveFart]

Alinsky nursed and taught hatred for the elected majority. That is on the sociopathic spectrum.
He brought a gang war mentality to party politics as much as any of the names you mentioned.
And he was actually aligned with Capone's Frank Nitti and helped poison the well of Chicago politics.
Now his apprentice is poisoning our polities.

"The community organizer ... must first rub raw the resentments of the people; fan the latent hostilities to the point of overt expression.'   
-Saul Alinsky

[onan]

In politics, having 5000 signatures is hardly enough to get attention from congress. To be successful in grass root movements a community organizer is essential. Both sides do it. Ask Ben Shapiro, Mark Levin, or dozens of others.

Most of the posters in the politics forum would agree politics is a dirty business and will then point to the other side.

[136 or 142]

Alinsky nursed and taught hatred for the elected majority. That is on the sociopathic spectrum.

So, by that measure, does your hatred of Obama put you on the sociopathic spectrum?

[3OctaveFart]

Hate is a strong word. I hate his lies. I hate what he's doing to our country. I hate that he has made us a laughingstock around the world.

[136 or 142]

Hate is a strong word. I hate his lies. I hate what he's doing to our country. I hate that he has made us a laughingstock around the world.

You're confusing Obama with Dumbya.

[3OctaveFart]

Rahm Emanuel, Obama's henchman- I would probably say I hate that rotten son of a bitch.

[VtaGeezer]

"The community organizer ... must first rub raw the resentments of the people; fan the latent hostilities to the point of overt expression.'   
-Saul Alinsky

That would make Limbagh, Savage, Hannity, O'Reilly, Levin, Coulter, Beck, Cruz, Palen, Santorum, and a whole lot more of your ideological heroes, hard core Alinsky followers all. 

[3OctaveFart]

In addition to being a community organizer, which is most definately a real job, Obama was also a law professor (or lecturer if you insist, I've seen both)

We've been over this on this thread- the future Philosopher-King never produced one work of legal scholarship.
That is more than odd for someone who is hoisted up as some great academic.

[VtaGeezer]

"...hoisted up as some great academic."

By whom?  Be specific.  I'll tell you...by no one whose intent wasn't to twist into some kind of perverted smear.

"No legal scholarship"?  What's the the Harvard Law Review? And a JD from Harvard isn't scholarly enough for you.  He was a lecturer at a top law school; not a tenured professor paid to write legal papers, and you try to marginalize his resume for being a successful activist lawyer. 

One of the rottenest and most dishonest recent practices of the right's moral pygmies is to troll all over the map to drag any detail of Obama's career into your perpetual nullification campaign in attempts to chop him down to your own diminutive moral statures.  Obama's resume speaks for itself and of success...unlike so many leading conservatives who've never seen a paycheck not from an appointed govt job, or a campaign job, or the family trust fund, or from one of Daddy's pals.

[136 or 142]

We've been over this on this thread- the future Philosopher-King never produced one work of legal scholarship.
That is more than odd for someone who is hoisted up as some great academic.

He was a part time law professor/lecturer.  I've never heard anybody call him a 'great academic' other than the U of Chicago was impressed enough with Obama that they wanted to hire him as a full time professor.

[3OctaveFart]

Ya, those Kennedys sure were self-made. Daddy's distended teat didn't help them advance a bit.
I would think an egomaniac who was reputed to be the ideas guy would put some of them to paper for peer review.
Not counting the valentine he wrote to his sex tourist father.

[VtaGeezer]

Ya, those Kennedys sure were self-made. Daddy's distended teat didn't help them advance a bit.
I would think an egomaniac who was reputed to be the ideas guy would put some of them to paper for peer review.
Not counting the valentine he wrote to his sex tourist father.

It's no surprise you take shelter in the sewer.

[3OctaveFart]

And I'm disappointed you would fall back on personal attacks, when you have been civil in the past.
Don't be like your brethren and react angrily to being disagreed with.
He's a poor president and doesn't deserve your feverish defense.

[VtaGeezer]

And I'm disappointed you would fall back on personal attacks, when you have been civil in the past.
Don't be like your brethren and react angrily to being disagreed with.
He's a poor president and doesn't deserve your feverish defense.

No anger, just observation.  No feverish defense; just a little decency.  Try it sometime, pilgrim. 

[3OctaveFart]

Which comment was indecent?
The Kennedys had their inroads to politics paved by others.
Mr. Obama was not the saint his son makes him out to be and that is a matter of record.
I'm not going to varnish the truth to comfort your insecurities.

[b_dubb]

If we're going to bring people's padres into this how about Prescott Bush and his business dealings with the NAZIs.

[VtaGeezer]

Which comment was indecent?
The Kennedys had their inroads to politics paved by others.
Mr. Obama was not the saint his son makes him out to be and that is a matter of record.
I'm not going to varnish the truth to comfort your insecurities.

Varnish is translucent and usually enhances and protects.  Your treatment of the truth is more like shabby vinyl siding.