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What is in my Father's notebook?

Started by Walks_At_Night, October 13, 2018, 06:20:43 PM

Page 7 continues the discussion of the warhead of the Mark XV torpedo and is written in cursive and in pencil.   There appears to be the numbers 5, 7 and 9 to denote different topics but I'm not sure what happened to the even numbers.  Section 7 discusses an interposer between the warhead and the air flask that contains and additional 205.1 pounds of Grade  "A" T.N.T and is called Mark 2 Warhead Extension

Page 7

The top of page is written in cursive and finishes the description of the torpedo's warhead.   That is followed by a list entitled
Lubricating and Preservative Materials which lists the seven different types used in the Mark XV torpedo.  I'll admit that I
had to look up what Petrolatum was.  The bottom of the page discusses Hot Running Torpedo Oil and the places it used,
followed by FGyro Oil and the places it is used.

Page 8


It will be quite a few pages until we get to the mechanical drawings in the notebook.  So to break things up and keep the thread
a little more interesting, I'll intersperse some of the posts with what the US Navy was like at the beginning of 1942. 

Here is a diagram of the contents of a sailors sea bag from about that time:



Here is how the layout would look in real life:


I'm not sure how you get a Pea Coat folded up that tightly!

K_Dubb

This is excellent, Walks, thank you for your careful documentation.

I have experimented with my dad's vintage-1960 peacoat and, with some practice and the help of the ties depicted, I think I could get it to a little larger than a pair of shoes as shown in the illustration.  I don't believe a peacoat is shown in the photograph; the impossibly small buttoned thing in its place must be a pair of dark blue trousers, which iirc are fall-front with a double row of buttons.

There are a couple Navy guys in my family I've compared my dad's with, and I'm sure modern ones could be folded quite a bit smaller.  That wool they used back then is amazing stuff, both in thickness and in its silky finish.

Jackstar

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 27, 2018, 07:14:36 PM
I'll intersperse some of the posts with what the US Navy was like at the beginning of 1942. 

[attachment=1]


Oh, God, if only we could ever truly know.

Quote from: K_Dubb on October 28, 2018, 10:41:35 PM
This is excellent, Walks, thank you for your careful documentation.

I have experimented with my dad's vintage-1960 peacoat and, with some practice and the help of the ties depicted, I think I could get it to a little larger than a pair of shoes as shown in the illustration.  I don't believe a peacoat is shown in the photograph; the impossibly small buttoned thing in its place must be a pair of dark blue trousers, which iirc are fall-front with a double row of buttons.

There are a couple Navy guys in my family I've compared my dad's with, and I'm sure modern ones could be folded quite a bit smaller.  That wool they used back then is amazing stuff, both in thickness and in its silky finish.

It can be done!  Thanks for poking around.  Hopefully your Dad's coat came through unscathed....................

Page 9 continues to document all the places in the Mark XV torpedo where all the various oils and lubricants are used

Page 9

Hats

My Dad was issued two hats - the first one was of dark blue wool and was known as the "Donald Duck Hat".  It had a flat top and
was not particularly popular.  This hat was authorized in 1852 and were an official part of a US Navy sailor's uniform up until April of 1963.
Until January of 1941, the hats had the sailors ship or post embroidered on the front but due to security concerns this was changed to
a generic U.S. Navy. 

I have a formal picture of my father wearing one upon his graduation from Torpedo School but we'll have to wait until the end of the
Notebook to see it.   ;)

The hat looks this:


The most famous picture from WWII that I know of, that actually has US sailors wearing it, is the one of the Sullivans. 


They were five brothers who convinced the Navy to bend the rule that forbade siblings to serve on the same ship.  Sadly the worst happened and their ship, the light cruiser USS Juneau was sunk during the Guadalcanal campaign.  All five of the Sullivan's were killed.   It was only this year that the wreck of the  USS Juneau was located:



Of course other Navy's used the same style of hat. Here are examples from the same era of  Kriegsmarine and Imperial Japanese Navy sailors:




The second hat my Dad was issued was the "Dixie Cup" hat (It is almost uniquely American - I think the Philippine and Bolivian Navies also use it).  First issued in 1886 it is the hat that comes to mind when one thinks of an enlisted US Navy sailor.   It seems like only nerds wore the hat properly during the war.  The cool guys either wore it as far back on their heads as they could or cocked off to the side.   It was a way to express your individuality I guess.  Here is an example of three guys chatting up an Aussie:



My Dad was back of the head kind of a guy.  I once asked him how it stayed on worn that way and he said simply "It just does"

I've also seen pictures of WWII sailors wearing a darker version.  From what I've been able to determine these were worn by the
"Black Gang" guys.   These were the guys that worked in the propulsion system of the ship - the engine room and boiler and they
would dye their hats as the white would show up the dirt too easily.   The term "Black Gang" goes back to the days of coal powered
ships.  Here is an example:






I guess the Navy finally issued this to "remind" sailors of the proper way to wear their hat:


Quote from: Jackstar on October 28, 2018, 10:56:50 PM
[attachment=1,msg1272212]


Oh, God, if only we could ever truly know.

It would seem that Rebecca DeMornay's Grandmother now "knows"


WOTR

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 29, 2018, 06:22:46 PM

Here is an example:



It is interesting what was (Redacted) in the background.  Looks like a three masted ship in the one (probably not- but that is the impression.)  I wonder why they would take it out when the ships would all be days away form that location when the photograph would likely be developed...

Uncle Duke

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 29, 2018, 06:22:46 PM
Hats

My Dad was issued two hats - the first one was of dark blue wool and was known as the "Donald Duck Hat".  It had a flat top and
was not particularly popular.  This hat was authorized in 1852 and were an official part of a US Navy sailor's uniform up until April of 1963.
Until January of 1941, the hats had the sailors ship or post embroidered on the front but due to security concerns this was changed to
a generic U.S. Navy. 

I have a formal picture of my father wearing one upon his graduation from Torpedo School but we'll have to wait until the end of the
Notebook to see it.   ;)

The hat looks this:


The most famous picture from WWII that I know of, that actually has US sailors wearing it, is the one of the Sullivans. 


They were five brothers who convinced the Navy to bend the rule that forbade siblings to serve on the same ship.  Sadly the worst happened and their ship, the light cruiser USS Juneau was sunk during the Guadalcanal campaign.  All five of the Sullivan's were killed.   It was only this year that the wreck of the  USS Juneau was located:



Of course other Navy's used the same style of hat. Here are examples from the same era of  Kriegsmarine and Imperial Japanese Navy sailors:




The second hat my Dad was issued was the "Dixie Cup" hat (It is almost uniquely American - I think the Philippine and Bolivian Navies also use it).  First issued in 1886 it is the hat that comes to mind when one thinks of an enlisted US Navy sailor.   It seems like only nerds wore the hat properly during the war.  The cool guys either wore it as far back on their heads as they could or cocked off to the side.   It was a way to express your individuality I guess.  Here is an example of three guys chatting up an Aussie:



My Dad was back of the head kind of a guy.  I once asked him how it stayed on worn that way and he said simply "It just does"

I've also seen pictures of WWII sailors wearing a darker version.  From what I've been able to determine these were worn by the
"Black Gang" guys.   These were the guys that worked in the propulsion system of the ship - the engine room and boiler and they
would dye their hats as the white would show up the dirt too easily.   The term "Black Gang" goes back to the days of coal powered
ships.  Here is an example:



Were the ships in the background of that last photo whited-out by censors during the war?

The mystery of the altered photo:



From what I've learned so far is that the picture is from the Light Cruiser USS Denver and that the ships in the background were
removed to hide which other ships were operating with her.   That theory is found here: https://selvedgeyard.com/2009/01/30/old-navy/

The picture was almost certainly taken on a Cleveland Class American Light Cruiser.  The two forward triple 6 inch gun turrets followed by a row of double 5 inch gun turrets is a dead give away.  Here is a picture of the USS Denver which seems to match up nicely:


Another possibility is that the obfuscated ships in the background showed off either a  SG "Sugar George" or CXAM radar array and they did not want that released.   





Uncle Duke

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 29, 2018, 09:34:11 PM
The mystery of the altered photo:



From what I've learned so far is that the picture is from the Light Cruiser USS Denver and that the ships in the background were
removed to hide which other ships were operating with her.   That theory is found here: https://selvedgeyard.com/2009/01/30/old-navy/

The picture was almost certainly taken on a Cleveland Class American Light Cruiser.  The two forward triple 6 inch gun turrets followed by a row of double 5 inch gun turrets is a dead give away.  Here is a picture of the USS Denver which seems to match up nicely:


Another possibility is that the obfuscated ships in the background showed off either a  SG "Sugar George" or CXAM radar array and they did not want that released.   



WWII censors have always fascinated me.  In addition to removing things they didn't want the enemy to see, they would also white out or otherwise obscure things that weren't even there to make the enemy try to figure out what they were trying to hide. 

Have you ever read "Catch 22?" The bit about the officers making a game out of censoring the enlisted men's mail home was a hoot.  "Death to all adjectives!"

Quote from: Uncle Duke on October 30, 2018, 03:58:30 PM
WWII censors have always fascinated me.  In addition to removing things they didn't want the enemy to see, they would also white out or otherwise obscure things that weren't even there to make the enemy try to figure out what they were trying to hide. 

Have you ever read "Catch 22?" The bit about the officers making a game out of censoring the enlisted men's mail home was a hoot.  "Death to all adjectives!"

I've read "Catch 22" a whole bunch of times.  Chief White Halfoat might be my favorite all time literary figure.


The "3 masted" ship might also be a Liberty Ship.  Not sure why that would be worth censoring.   They were ubiquitous.................





Page 10 is written in ink using cursive and describes the Mark 4 Booster Extender

Page 10


Work Clothes

For daily shipboard life, a US Sailor in WWII had a pretty reasonable working uniform.   Usually a blue chambray long sleeve shirt, worn over a
white T-Shirt and blue jeans were worn.   The jeans were called dungarees and of course a brand new pair could be rather stiff and uncomfortable.
Dad said what they would do, was to weigh the new pair of pants down with some weight, tie a rope to it and throw it off the stern of the ship.
The agitation from the wash of the propellers would soften them up nicely.  Not exactly stone washed but I'm sure it was effective...........



Here are some typical shots of sailors at work and one hanging up some wash to dry.



K_Dubb

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 30, 2018, 08:32:19 PM
Page 10 is written in ink using cursive and describes the Mark 4 Booster Extender

Page 10



How do you imagine this information was imparted, Walks?  The minimal correction and well-organized narrative suggest dictation, with transcription serving both for memory and later reference in a way a printed manual might not.  I wonder how often he consulted this notebook.

WOTR

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 30, 2018, 05:41:14 PM
I've read "Catch 22" a whole bunch of times.  Chief White Halfoat might be my favorite all time literary figure.


The "3 masted" ship might also be a Liberty Ship.  Not sure why that would be worth censoring.   They were ubiquitous.................



Cool theory.  I had not even considered that.

WOTR

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 29, 2018, 05:40:20 PM
Page 9 continues to document all the places in the Mark XV torpedo where all the various oils and lubricants are used

Page 9


A few things stick out.  I assume that every one was on a "one way journey?"  I assume that they were not picked up in the case of a "miss" which makes me wonder about the necessity of oiling and lubing them...  I know sea water, time, rust...  But if you have ever used vaseline, you will know how well the petrolatum should have stuck.  How often would they lubricate them- just once prior to launch, or a regular basis?


Rix Gins

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 30, 2018, 08:40:05 PM

Dad said what they would do, was to weigh the new pair of pants down with some weight, tie a rope to it and throw it off the stern of the ship.
The agitation from the wash of the propellers would soften them up nicely.  Not exactly stone washed but I'm sure it was effective...........

As a kid, I recall an old neighbor guy relating the above, though he might have been trying to wash regular laundry, I'm not sure.  Anyway, there was a whole line of sailors doing it and an officer saw them.  He pulled out his knife and cut everybody's ropes apart.

Hog

Great thread.  I have a similar notebook from Basic Military Qualifications aka Boot Camp from my early army days.  It was a black covered notebook, stapled together filled with endless pages of my handwriting.  Nuclear Biological Chemical (NBC) warfare and how to fight in such an environment, weapons, tactics, just the basics..  Much of this equipment is almost exactly the same as American equipment that was used in the first 1991 Gulf War.

There was a book that we were issued at the very start of boot camp called "The Warrior", Land Force Central Area, Individual Combat Skills Handbook.  It also covers many of the topics that we were forced to write, study and be tested about, but this was the formal DND copy(Department of National Defence).  It is printed on "special paper" that resists mildewing.  The Canadian Army was broken up into areas of geographical coverage, into Divisions.  I was in the 4th Canadian Division, which was formerly known as Land Force Central Area.  This covered most of the province of Ontario.  The 3rd Canadian Division(known as Land Force West Area covered the Western side of Canada, the 2nd Can Division aka Land Force Quebec Area covered Quebec.  I began as a gunner with an Infantry Unit which was part of the Royal Canadian Regiment (RCR).  I had much experience with the 5.56mm NATO Light Machine Gun(LMG) which carried the Canadian code of C-9 and the heavier 7.62mm NATO Genmeral Purpose Machine Gun (GPMG) it was known as the C-6.  Our standard issue rifle comparable to the USA M-16 is the C-7, which has a fire selector with 3 positions: 1)safe 2) semi auto 3) fully automatic automatic, no 3 round burst like some of the US models of M16 used to have.

At the start of my career we were training in a post "Cold War" environment and after the Gulf War was over, we were de escalating our forces, just as many American forces were.
No matter, our best forces got the best equipment. We were and remain some of the best on an international stage. esp. after being proven with our quick deployment a couple weeks after 9/11. 

For the Gulf War, we were part of the 35 country,  USA led coaltition, we had 4500 Canadians that served in that 1990-91 effort, we called it Operation Friction.
We supported Operation Desert Shield with a VERY small naval flotilla (I was personally embarrassed with our naval effort- a couple destroyers and a supply ship) and the RCAF with her CF-18 Hornet fighter jets was better. This was the first time since Korea that the RCAF was actively involved in air combat operations.  Our 2 squadrons, 24 jets, plus 27 CC-130 Hercules and 5 CC-137 Boeing 707 and other support jets.
.
We would have a week of AM classes, then we we would be tested on said material at the end of the week.  If you don;t pass, eventually you get dropped, but that never happened. 
The instructors would literally read out or notes, and we would copy them down.  It was a long arduous process.  Honestly I hadn't looked at that notebook until I saw this thread.  In my military career the info wasn't referred back to.  Read, write, memorize the concepts and then pass the test. We sat there sweating our asses off, trying to copy this info down as quickly as possible, when finished we'd get a break and go upstairs, outside on the edge of the parade square and enjoy our 5 minute cigarette breaks.

I know that the German Navy printed sensitive information using a special paper/ink combination that would wash out upon becoming wet. CodeBooks and other info for the Enigma code machines could be rendered useless to an enemy by simply wetting the book. No shredding or burning needed.

I haven't had the chance to actually read any of the notebook portions in this thread.  I wonder what the 3-50 means? I'm sure I'll have some comments after digging into your thread.  I bet it's something that's not near as interesting as the allure of not knowing it's meaning.
Military service can be a love hate sort of thing.  For me it started when I was young, mid 90's, my basic army training was straightforward, as the years went by and my training became more focussed and things became very interesting.  My early infantry career was the best time of my life, the times, the comradery, the laughs, it was great.  Those good times tempered with some tears, but in my mind I think that you have to taste some sour in order to appreciate sweet..

thanks for sharing Mr At Night.

peace
Hog


Uncle Duke

Quote from: Walks_At_Night on October 30, 2018, 08:40:05 PM
Work Clothes

For daily shipboard life, a US Sailor in WWII had a pretty reasonable working uniform.   Usually a blue chambray long sleeve shirt, worn over a
white T-Shirt and blue jeans were worn.   The jeans were called dungarees and of course a brand new pair could be rather stiff and uncomfortable.
Dad said what they would do, was to weigh the new pair of pants down with some weight, tie a rope to it and throw it off the stern of the ship.
The agitation from the wash of the propellers would soften them up nicely.  Not exactly stone washed but I'm sure it was effective...........


There was an episode of "McHale's Navy" where the crew was running a laundry service. They'd fill a well ventilated 55 gal drum full of clothes and laundry soap, and tow it at high speed behind the PT boat.  Things were going well until a Japanese sub fired a torpedo that hit the drum instead of the boat.  Gruber wound up getting a Purple Heart when a small sliver of the drum nicked his finger.

Uncle Duke

Quote from: Hog on October 31, 2018, 06:44:05 AM
Great thread.  I have a similar notebook from Basic Military Qualifications aka Boot Camp from my early army days.  It was a black covered notebook, stapled together filled with endless pages of my handwriting.  Nuclear Biological Chemical (NBC) warfare and how to fight in such an environment, weapons, tactics, just the basics..  Much of this equipment is almost exactly the same as American equipment that was used in the first 1991 Gulf War.

There was a book that we were issued at the very start of boot camp called "The Warrior", Land Force Central Area, Individual Combat Skills Handbook.  It also covers many of the topics that we were forced to write, study and be tested about, but this was the formal DND copy(Department of National Defence).  It is printed on "special paper" that resists mildewing.  The Canadian Army was broken up into areas of geographical coverage, into Divisions.  I was in the 4th Canadian Division, which was formerly known as Land Force Central Area.  This covered most of the province of Ontario.  The 3rd Canadian Division(known as Land Force West Area covered the Western side of Canada, the 2nd Can Division aka Land Force Quebec Area covered Quebec.  I began as a gunner with an Infantry Unit which was part of the Royal Canadian Regiment (RCR).  I had much experience with the 5.56mm NATO Light Machine Gun(LMG) which carried the Canadian code of C-9 and the heavier 7.62mm NATO Genmeral Purpose Machine Gun (GPMG) it was known as the C-6.  Our standard issue rifle comparable to the USA M-16 is the C-7, which has a fire selector with 3 positions: 1)safe 2) semi auto 3) fully automatic automatic, no 3 round burst like some of the US models of M16 used to have.

At the start of my career we were training in a post "Cold War" environment and after the Gulf War was over, we were de escalating our forces, just as many American forces were.
No matter, our best forces got the best equipment. We were and remain some of the best on an international stage. esp. after being proven with our quick deployment a couple weeks after 9/11. 

For the Gulf War, we were part of the 35 country,  USA led coaltition, we had 4500 Canadians that served in that 1990-91 effort, we called it Operation Friction.
We supported Operation Desert Shield with a VERY small naval flotilla (I was personally embarrassed with our naval effort- a couple destroyers and a supply ship) and the RCAF with her CF-18 Hornet fighter jets was better. This was the first time since Korea that the RCAF was actively involved in air combat operations.  Our 2 squadrons, 24 jets, plus 27 CC-130 Hercules and 5 CC-137 Boeing 707 and other support jets.
.
We would have a week of AM classes, then we we would be tested on said material at the end of the week.  If you don;t pass, eventually you get dropped, but that never happened. 
The instructors would literally read out or notes, and we would copy them down.  It was a long arduous process.  Honestly I hadn't looked at that notebook until I saw this thread.  In my military career the info wasn't referred back to.  Read, write, memorize the concepts and then pass the test. We sat there sweating our asses off, trying to copy this info down as quickly as possible, when finished we'd get a break and go upstairs, outside on the edge of the parade square and enjoy our 5 minute cigarette breaks.

I know that the German Navy printed sensitive information using a special paper/ink combination that would wash out upon becoming wet. CodeBooks and other info for the Enigma code machines could be rendered useless to an enemy by simply wetting the book. No shredding or burning needed.

I haven't had the chance to actually read any of the notebook portions in this thread.  I wonder what the 3-50 means? I'm sure I'll have some comments after digging into your thread.  I bet it's something that's not near as interesting as the allure of not knowing it's meaning.
Military service can be a love hate sort of thing.  For me it started when I was young, mid 90's, my basic army training was straightforward, as the years went by and my training became more focussed and things became very interesting.  My early infantry career was the best time of my life, the times, the comradery, the laughs, it was great.  Those good times tempered with some tears, but in my mind I think that you have to taste some sour in order to appreciate sweet..

thanks for sharing Mr At Night.

peace
Hog

3-50 probably means 3 inch/50 cal gun, a standard dual purpose gun carried on USN warships for many years.

I'd have to go back to get details, but a CF-18 pilot in the Gulf War was prevented from becoming the first Canadian to score an air-to-air kill since the Korean War.  For political reasons, it was decided to allow a Saudi F-15 pilot to shoot down a couple Iraqi F1s attempting to strike a Saudi oil facility rather than the CF-18 that was closer and in position.

Quote from: K_Dubb on October 30, 2018, 10:58:50 PM
How do you imagine this information was imparted, Walks?  The minimal correction and well-organized narrative suggest dictation, with transcription serving both for memory and later reference in a way a printed manual might not.  I wonder how often he consulted this notebook.

As near as I can tell, the US Navy Torpedo School was run in a manner similar to a College Physics class - with a Lecture, Recitation and Lab.
I think the hands on "Lab" portion made up most of the schedule. 

This picture was taken at the Newport, Rhode Island school - which at the time my Dad went through was the only game in town.  The Navy designed and developed their own torpedoes, manufactured and trained their personnel all on Goat Island, Newport, R.I.



Soon afterwards, a number of other torpedo schools opened and torpedo production was shared with private industry - International Harvester and Pontiac being two suppliers.    This set of photos was taken at the Norfolk Torpedo School later in the war


Quote from: WOTR on October 31, 2018, 12:16:26 AM
A few things stick out.  I assume that every one was on a "one way journey?"  I assume that they were not picked up in the case of a "miss" which makes me wonder about the necessity of oiling and lubing them...  I know sea water, time, rust...  But if you have ever used vaseline, you will know how well the petrolatum should have stuck.  How often would they lubricate them- just once prior to launch, or a regular basis?

It would depend on the warhead loaded on the torpedo.  An exercise head would use water as ballast and at the end of the run, the water would
be expunged and the torpedo would float.   It could then be recovered for re-use.  Here is an example of a recovery - this is a Mark 48 torpedo being recovered at a much later date but the same principle would apply. 



I've seen some documentation of an exercise warhead that would release plywood disks that would float to the surface.  I am assuming that those would have been used in the development and testing of the magnetic anomaly detonator.  They were supposed to travel underneath a ship, detect a magnetic anomaly from the steel used in the ship and explode.  Unfortunately they were developed and tested off the coast of Rhode Island and of course what no one thought of was that the magnetic field differs through out the globe so the whiz bang magnetic exploder was essentially useless. 

A warshot was definitely a one way trip.  The unit cost for a torpedo was somewhere between $10,000 and $15,000 - an enormous sum for a single weapon.  I've seen the unit cost for the US Navy's front line fighter at the time, the Grumman F4F Wildcat at about $30,000.  So in
today's thinking, half an F-35! 

The destroyer based torpedoes sat in torpedo tubes that were topside like this:

* I think the yellow fish is an exercise head and the red ones are war shots.

So I'd imagine that there were probably many things on a routine maintenance schedule that needed attending to.   I don't think they ate up
much time - from what Dad said, he spent most of his time at sea, looking through a pair of binoculars on watch.


Quote from: Hog on October 31, 2018, 06:44:05 AM
Great thread.  I have a similar notebook from Basic Military Qualifications aka Boot Camp from my early army days.  It was a black covered notebook, stapled together filled with endless pages of my handwriting.  Nuclear Biological Chemical (NBC) warfare and how to fight in such an environment, weapons, tactics, just the basics..  Much of this equipment is almost exactly the same as American equipment that was used in the first 1991 Gulf War.

thanks for sharing Mr At Night.

peace
Hog

Thanks Hog.  I'll cover my Father's impression of the different Allies he came in contact with later on but I'll say that the had a very favorable impression of the Royal Canadian Navy.

Quote from: Rix Gins on October 31, 2018, 02:20:35 AM
As a kid, I recall an old neighbor guy relating the above, though he might have been trying to wash regular laundry, I'm not sure.  Anyway, there was a whole line of sailors doing it and an officer saw them.  He pulled out his knife and cut everybody's ropes apart.

What a dick!

Page 3 is written in ink, with some corrections and slight smearing down towards the bottom of the page.  It discussed the Mark 3 Pistol which
I believe was a part of the contact exploder mechanism for the Mark XV Torpedo.  It did not function well either.  When the torpedo struck the side of ship, the nose of the torpedo would compress and the firing pin would deflect and thus the warhead would not explode.  This was one of the three main issues that plagued American torpedoes early in the war.

Page 11

Footwear

From what I have been able to learn, most US Navy sailors wore low quarter shoes aboard ship.   An actual example is shown here:



They look slippery as hell!   Not sure I would want to be running up and down ladders with them but that sure seems what was worn.

Here is an example



The other option appears to have been a short boot nicknamed "boon dockers"  that looks like it would have a better grip


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