Latest French Attacks: updates (in English)

[paladin1991]

To my great surprise, Hoagland's last two shows covered the history of Islam and it's relationship to IS very well.

As for Switzerland, my father participated in bombing a Swiss ball bearing factory that was supplying the Germans on April 1, 1944.  On the way back to England, he was shot down over France, turned in to the Nazis by the French, and spent the remainder of the war in Stalag-17B.  He did not get a prayer rug.  He did not get halal meals - in fact, he got little food at all.

Really?  That would be an interesting bit of history to suss out.  Any more details avail?

[albrecht]

Really?  That would be an interesting bit of history to suss out.  Any more details avail?

http://www.stalag17b.com/
One site I found.

[Juan]

You dad's group purposely bombed a factory in neutral Switzerland?  Any idea what unit he was serving in at the time of that raid?

8th Air Force, 337th bomb group IIRC.  before they took off, they were read the apology that would be issued.

[paladin1991]

8th Air Force, 337th bomb group IIRC.  before they took off, they were read the apology that would be issued.

Love it. 

[VtaGeezer]

Yeah, that is a concern amongst those folks who do this kind of work.  I understand that there is a device either under development or currently being tested that will shut down all cell and wi-fi within a certain range.

Everyone should send a message to the WH asking how it is that after a year of airstrikes, ISIS-held cities still have cell service. 

[GravitySucks]

...and within seconds of your first strike against Mecca, their brethren in Islamabad feel threatened and launch a preemptive strike on their neighbors in New Delhi, etc., etc.


                          (cliche, yet true)

They would never do that, Islam is the religion of peace

[FightTheFuture]

Channeling Albert Speer this morning?

The ol` perfunctory Nazi reference. Ya haven`t lost a step, Geezer.

[VtaGeezer]

The ol` perfunctory Nazi reference. Ya haven`t lost a step, Geezer.

No.  A reference to national hubris and exceptionalism as the justification for pointless catastrophic war.  Its hard to make any reference to a country initiating pointless catastrophic war without going there.  There was more to German aggression than the Holocaust and Nazi doctrine.  Godwin's Law is stupid and I pay no attention to it.

Now I've done it.   

[paladin1991]

No.  A reference to national hubris and exceptionalism as the justification for pointless catastrophic war.  Its hard to make any reference to a country initiating pointless catastrophic war without going there.  There was more to German aggression than the Holocaust and Nazi doctrine.  Godwin's Law is stupid and I pay no attention to it.

Now I've done it.   

You broke The Law!

[Eddie Coyle]

Channeling Albert Speer this morning?

    I vas only designing ze buildings!

[GuerrillaUnReal]

Then the American citizen might wake the fuck up and realized that all the LEO agencies and the gov't are not tasked with keeping them alive or safe.  Ppl would start being more proactive and take up some personal accountability for their existence.

How'd that work after 9/11?

[GuerrillaUnReal]

With all due respect, I'm having trouble understanding why we're condemning a billion people because of some fucked up cults and gangs in the middle east? It's like condemning Christianity because gang members bling cross necklaces.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all about killing the evil mothers fuckers on this planet. But I fail to see what sexually repressed pieces of human shit who play behead the white guy 10,000 miles on the other side of planet have to do with Achmed, the dude who sells me a slurpee when I'm blitzed out of my head at 3 in the morning.

I think all religion is stupid but honestly I'm happy about so many people being in the stone age. Thank christ they're not involving themselves in international economics where they could really fuck some stuff up. They want to blow themselves up every once in awhile because they're sexually frustrated, whatever. These idiots are just islamic versions of social justice warriors.

[FightTheFuture]

A reference to national hubris and exceptionalism as the justification for pointless catastrophic war

That`s a ridiculous assertion. I`m not in the mood to reargue the Iraq debacle; it`s been done too many times in here already. But to compare it to Nazi aggression...please.

There was ample justification for invasion. That didn`t mean invasion was necessary. I favored a more conservative approach, but I wasn`t in charge. However, once in, I thought the conflict could have been conducted differently without the grotesque number of casualties. Once again, I wasn`t in charge. Instead of listening to the people who knew how to get the job done, Bush chose the Pottery Barn doctrine as his guiding principle. THAT was a catastrophic mistake.

[pyewacket]

With all due respect, I'm having trouble understanding why we're condemning a billion people because of some fucked up cults and gangs in the middle east? It's like condemning Christianity because gang members bling cross necklaces.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all about killing the evil mothers fuckers on this planet. But I fail to see what sexually repressed pieces of human shit who play behead the white guy 10,000 miles on the other side of planet have to do with Achmed, the dude who sells me a slurpee when I'm blitzed out of my head at 3 in the morning.

I think all religion is stupid but honestly I'm happy about so many people being in the stone age. Thank christ they're not involving themselves in international economics where they could really fuck some stuff up. They want to blow themselves up every once in awhile because they're sexually frustrated, whatever. These idiots are just islamic versions of social justice warriors.

Quimby- I understand your sentiments, but I think this has morphed into something quite beyond mere religion. It's become a group of cult like political movements that don't want to live in peace with anyone. Here's a good article to show just a portion of how widespread and dangerous these "cults and gangs" have become- just in the US alone. Should we still be eager to take in "refugees"?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3322649/The-enemy-Nearly-SEVENTY-arrested-America-ISIS-plots-include-refugees-given-safe-haven-turned-terror.html

[VtaGeezer]

Here's a good article...

That's an oxymoron.  Its the Daily Mail.

[Uncle Duke]

The Russians have their own navigation satellites. They don't use GPS for their weapons systems.

Sure, poor choice of wording on my part.  I used "GPS" as a generic term for navsats, should have just said "satellite interface".

[Uncle Duke]

I did read about that in HS AP history.  That was some shit.  I used to think that the Irish were happy go lucky drinking partners for anyone who happened to show up at the bar.
Now I look back and realize, they're just some serious competition for the bartenders attention.

I think Ireland was the only member of the British Commonwealth that did not declare war on the Axis.  Probably comes as no surprise the Irish were anti-British, but not necessarily pro-German in WWII.  They became more pro Allies after the US got in the war, however.  To me the most interesting aspect of WWII for the Irish was their refusal to allow the Brits use of the "treaty ports" in western Ireland by the RN for escorts during the Battle of the Atlantic. 

[Uncle Duke]

8th Air Force, 337th bomb group IIRC.  before they took off, they were read the apology that would be issued.

Thanks for the info. I've never heard this story and look forward to researching it.  I do remember the US "accidently" hitting a Swiss power plant along the border of occupied France and claiming "navigation error", but the ball bearings factory is new to me.

[pyewacket]

That's an oxymoron.  Its the Daily Mail.

I'm not arguing with your opinion- what did they get wrong?

[SciFiAuthor]

George had a guest on C2C after these missile strikes who claimed the US brought those "failed" missiles down using some sort of EMP ray weapon.  Sounded like utter bullshit, but then I began to wonder.  Would it be possible to interfere with/jam a cruise missile guidance system (GPS interface?) and just run the thing out of fuel?
Causing a Russian cruise missile to impact somewhere in Iran would be a win-win for the US, certainly seeing the Russians and Iranians at odds after such an incident would be viewed as positive in the US.

That's a good question. If we had that kind of capability this would have been a good time to demonstrate it. I know that this specific cruise missile type was something that we were concerned about strategically, and the 900 mile 26 missile attack was obviously a demonstration of the system by the Russians so it wouldn't surprise me if we did it. But it also wouldn't surprise me if Russian cruise missiles are simply unreliable.

[K_Dubb]

I had a professor who had been a member of the Norwegian underground as a teenager in WWII.  He hated the Swedes more than he hated the Nazi who occupied his country.  In his mind, and those of his countryman of that generation apparently, the Swedes abandoned the Norwegians to the Germans despite strong cultural ties and mutual defense agreements.  As you inferred, the Swedes made a fortune in WWII selling iron ore and ball bearing to the Germans.

Every read about the "neutrality" of Ireland in WWII?

Not to mention interning Norwegian refugees in pretty poor conditions.  Today's refugees have it made in comparison.

The Swedes have always been a smug, pragmatic lot.

[GuerrillaUnReal]

That's a good question. If we had that kind of capability this would have been a good time to demonstrate it. I know that this specific cruise missile type was something that we were concerned about strategically, and the 900 mile 26 missile attack was obviously a demonstration of the system by the Russians so it wouldn't surprise me if we did it. But it also wouldn't surprise me if Russian cruise missiles are simply unreliable.

That is extremely interesting. We have historically greatly underrated our technological capabilities and greatly overrated Eastern technology. I'm reminded of how we'd think the latest greatest MIGs were greatly outpacing our planes. Then a Russian or Chinese pilot would defect with one and we'd find out that we had greatly overrated their capabilities.

Given our massive jump on the rest of the world on computer technology and our somewhat open society where geniuses are encouraged and big league hackers are hired rather than imprisoned, I could see us completely owning the digital age and being able to do things like this.

When you think about it a Russian cruise missile is going to connect to a Russian satellite to receive it's guidance and orders. That seems to me that would be pretty easy to break into especially given how far ahead of them we are in digital technology.

Crashing one into Iran like you said would be a win/win on all fronts. I'm not sure you'd want to tip your hand that you have that ability but at the same time, there is a western sense of humor to it. Like when we owned Iranian Nuclear Plants through a cyber virus that took over their computer systems while blasting AC/DC in 2012.   

[Eddie Coyle]

I think Ireland was the only member of the British Commonwealth that did not declare war on the Axis.  Probably comes as no surprise the Irish were anti-British, but not necessarily pro-German in WWII.  They became more pro Allies after the US got in the war, however.  To me the most interesting aspect of WWII for the Irish was their refusal to allow the Brits use of the "treaty ports" in western Ireland by the RN for escorts during the Battle of the Atlantic.

   Clair Wills had a pretty decent book in 2007 about Ireland's neutrality. I think de Valera's "Sorry for your loss, Germany" after Hitler's death was a PR disaster.

[SciFiAuthor]

With all due respect, I'm having trouble understanding why we're condemning a billion people because of some fucked up cults and gangs in the middle east? It's like condemning Christianity because gang members bling cross necklaces.

I think the problem is that everyone's been sitting around hoping the Muslims would clean house and take care of their internal extremism problem. We've been waiting since 2001 and they still haven't. I'd like to dismiss ISIS as a cult or gang as much as anyone else, but then I see shit like this "moment of silence" in Turkey:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wt9bMYcmUFg

What we're really seeing is Islam going increasing political with each successive movement, ISIS by far being the most political yet. Not all Germans were Nazis, but comparatively few Germans would have wanted Germany to lose the war. I fear that's what we're starting to see with Islam.

[Eddie Coyle]

  America's understanding of Sunni/Shia.


   Sunni: The girl Woody Allen was banging.

   Shia: That douche from The Transformers.

[chefist]

Syrians with stolen Greek passports trying to reach US via Honduras...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/18/us-france-shooting-honduras-idUSKCN0T72UE20151118

[SredniVashtar]

I'd like to dismiss ISIS as a cult or gang as much as anyone else, but then I see shit like this "moment of silence" in Turkey:

I wouldn't read too much into that. Turkish football fans are notoriously demented and expecting a moment of respectful silence from that lot was always going to be too much to expect. They pride themselves on being as hostile to opposition teams as possible, holding up signs with "welcome to Hell" and so on.

[Eddie Coyle]

I wouldn't read too much into that. Turkish football fans are notoriously demented and expecting a moment of respectful silence from that lot was always going to be too much to expect. They pride themselves on being as hostile to opposition teams as possible, holding up signs with "welcome to Hell" and so on.

     We've mentioned this before, but if asshole-itis is to be found a sporting event would be a great place to start. Euro Football in particular.

[GuerrillaUnReal]

I think the problem is that everyone's been sitting around hoping the Muslims would clean house and take care of their internal extremism problem. We've been waiting since 2001 and they still haven't. I'd like to dismiss ISIS as a cult or gang as much as anyone else, but then I see shit like this "moment of silence" in Turkey:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wt9bMYcmUFg

What we're really seeing is Islam going increasing political with each successive movement, ISIS by far being the most political yet. Not all Germans were Nazis, but comparatively few Germans would have wanted Germany to lose the war. I fear that's what we're starting to see with Islam.

I don't know how much of this stuff I buy anymore.

I tell you, back when I was younger during the Green Revolution. I was involved with some hacktivism where I was helping to relay messages and media out of the Middle East. One of the things I was involved in was getting media out from a relief effort on a ship named the Rachel Corrie that was bringing aid to a restricted zone somewhere near Palenstein. Now Israel attacked that boat, I watched Israel attack that boat, I watched Israel commandos land on that boat and ice several of the humanitarians, I watched the ship be fired on by Israel gunboats all in real time. Yet within 20 minutes of the event, all sorts of fake video had flooded the internet of the incident with Israel commandos being shown using restraint and absolutely no problems. By the next day, there were no reports in the mass media and what really happened had been drowned out online.

My point being, we see what we're supposed to see. Especially nowadays with the Israeli Megaphone Program and the amazing social media mind fuckery.

I just don't get what most Islams get with all this. Religion is bullshit. Even most religious people know it's bullshit. It's about power, wealth and the control of people. So what do Islamic folks get by cheering on the murder of 100s of innocent people?

[chefist]

I wouldn't read too much into that. Turkish football fans are notoriously demented and expecting a moment of respectful silence from that lot was always going to be too much to expect. They pride themselves on being as hostile to opposition teams as possible, holding up signs with "welcome to Hell" and so on.

They may have just been trolling. Though honestly, I never see those on the left defending other religions as they do Islam.  Why is that?