Marijuana

[MV/Liberace!]

But we got along fine without marijuana for millennia...

no, we didn't.  on the contrary, people have been smoking it for millennia.

[GeorgieForPresident2216]

no, we didn't.  on the contrary, people have been smoking it for millennia.

My bad.

[HorrorRetro]

I have to admit I thought about buying some the other day. I parked my car, and when I got out, I noticed I was parked in front of one of the new legal pot shops here.  I didn't venture in though. I have no idea what I'd want lol. It's been a very long time since I had any. Would be nice to find something that treats anxiety without causing me to feel like a zombie.

Here's what's on the menu: https://weedmaps.com/dispensaries/washington/n-tacoma-federal-way/cannabisclubcollective

[albrecht]

I'm for legalizing most, if not all drugs, and certainly for marijuana (with some stipulations on age before buying drugs) simply to try to cut back on the billions spent on the "war on drugs" and the corruption that comes with a popular illegal product. As for marijuana especially for industrial uses. Having said that it probably is not good for the person or society to use drugs, even marijuana. I recall when WA legalized and the first shop opened up the news was there. I recall laughing at an interview with a potential buyer in line. He seemed brain dead. Also the most popular questions, according to the news, was "what bus stop is closest to the shop." I was thinking these people don't even have cars but want to buy weed? And how can all these people be out in the middle of the day buying weed? Don't they have jobs, children, or school to keep them occupied?

[Gd5150]

"I don't want kids to smoke or drink,   because it dulls motivations and turns SOME kids, the individuals who can't control themselves, into zombies and idiots."

As though all the psychotropic drugs people have their kids on now don't do the same thing. Who needs pot, more than half the people out there kids & adults are on some anti-depressent/anxiety bs that turns them into a zombie.

What exactly is the benefit of including pot in society?  Why do we need it?

Agreed. But then the same could be said about all forms of self gratification, entertainment, most food, booze, video games, Bellgab. In the end, we already have enough losers, don't need to encourage making more by making pot easier to access.

[Kelt]

That's quite a totalitarian stance to take, "We've enough dopes, so we shouldn't legalise weed."

[saucerlike]

I'm no cancer patient but I have a hard time finding an appetite and getting sleep at night.  Both issues present way before I ever tried any drug.  After OTC products failed to help I now prefer mj.   I have a steady job but no insurance, and thankfully no kids.  Maybe not a long term solution but for now it's a relief.

[cweb]

The 60% less likely to finish high school statistic is so entertaining. I love how numbers can be squeezed out of what are likely to be one-sided studies. Maybe those 60% less likely kids just aren't motivated to begin with. Maybe they've already had addictive behaviors or psychological issues they're trying to fix with some herb. They call mj a gateway drug. Yes, it IS a gateway- if you have that type of personality. For other folks, it's a nice hobby.

Like others here, I am NOT advocating giving a joint to every high-schooler. Trying weed is something that you should do when you're mature enough to make an informed decision over whether it's worthwhile. Some people never reach that maturity. We call them stereotypes.

Yes, I am biased. Yes, I think the government should let adults do whatever drug they want. Yes, I think our culture is lacking in personal responsibility- which is why people are so afraid to let anyone have freedom; because some shithead is going to fuck it up.

We need to stop forcing behaviors on people and start motivating them to take care of themselves. Having that sense about yourself is what prevents you from trying something risky or harmful.

[eyenoeyeno]

Yes it is perfect

http://foriapleasure.com

Thank goodness I live in California.

Hehe

[GeorgieForPresident2216]

The 60% less likely to finish high school statistic is so entertaining. I love how numbers can be squeezed out of what are likely to be one-sided studies. Maybe those 60% less likely kids just aren't motivated to begin with. Maybe they've already had addictive behaviors or psychological issues they're trying to fix with some herb. They call mj a gateway drug. Yes, it IS a gateway- if you have that type of personality. For other folks, it's a nice hobby.

Like others here, I am NOT advocating giving a joint to every high-schooler. Trying weed is something that you should do when you're mature enough to make an informed decision over whether it's worthwhile. Some people never reach that maturity. We call them stereotypes.

Yes, I am biased. Yes, I think the government should let adults do whatever drug they want. Yes, I think our culture is lacking in personal responsibility- which is why people are so afraid to let anyone have freedom; because some shithead is going to fuck it up.

We need to stop forcing behaviors on people and start motivating them to take care of themselves. Having that sense about yourself is what prevents you from trying something risky or harmful.

Unfortunately, I think society is going in the exact opposite direction.  The more surveillance, the more policing, the more camera controlled intersections, the more homeland security... means the more people are going to develop an attitude of "if I can get away with it, it's okay."  As we take measures to control and restrict crimes, ultimately I think we just create a snowball effect.  More policing means less personal responsibility means more crime means more policing.  I guess this all goes against my belief pot shouldn't be legalized.  You're all giving me something to think about.

[Catsmile]

I've studied the brain quite a bit as an undergraduate ... But we got along fine without marijuana for millennia, and for most people it has no purpose other than providing yet another form of escape from their responsibilities.  What exactly is the benefit of including pot in society?  Why do we need it?

no, we didn't.  on the contrary, people have been smoking it for millennia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_history_of_cannabis_in_the_United_States

Cannabis has been used in many forms, for many reasons, for many millennia (not just smoking, or drug use), fact. Most likely even before written history. Somehow mankind as "limped" along just fine with this demon weed "marijuana." Cannabis was what it use to be called until the 1930s. Marijuana is what those "brown characters south of the border" called cannabis. Needing to demonize cannabis as much as possible they started calling it marijuana. Most people didn't know what marijuana was, and were more willing to crush this new threat to society. Your knowledge on cannabis, makes me question your knowledge on the brain, it at least shows some bias.

It could be argued that government making cannabis illegal, is more costly and dangerous to the public than re-legalizing it. DEA has not stopped the flow, or use of cannabis, or most illegal drugs to any real degree. Even though it's budget has exploded since it's creation in 1973. "In 1973 DEA had 1,470 Special Agents and a budget of less than $75 million. Today, the DEA has nearly 5,000 Special Agents and a budget of $2.02 billion." http://www.justice.gov/dea/about/history.shtml
The last year they have any info is 2008. 2008... Special Agents... 5,235, Budget... $2.4 BILLION, found on page 2 of the PDF, or page 161 of the document.  http://www.justice.gov/dea/about/history/2003-2008.pdf



Do I think recreational use of "marijuana" will make the wold a better place? No.
At the same time I see it as no worse than Tobacco, Alcohol ,Caffeine usage. The government has not been able to show that cannabis usage is worse than Tobacco, or Alcohol usage in any studies they have conducted since the 1970s up to today. Nixons own commissioned study concluded marijuana is probably no worse than Tobacco, or Alcohol, before he created the DEA and included marijuana as part of "an all-out global war on the drug menace." The DEA has not made a major impact on the influx of most illegal drugs from it's inception, despite laws, budget, or manpower.

So... in effect we are living with how marijuana will effect people/society today. With the added "benefit" of the government being able to compound any problems you have with cannabis, not helping. Making Cannabis illegal only makes it more dangerous to society, and makes it easier for kids to buy. Some of the added dangers of illegality are who you're dealing with, where did it come from, and what are you buying? Not to mention what the government will do to your life and family if you are caught.

Usage of Cannabis certainly doesn't merit any of the governments mandated loss of rights up to imprisonment.
People should never be put in a cage over what amounts to a medical health issue.
Cannabis should be regulated more like Tobacco, or Alcohol, including letting people grow for personal use.

[aldousburbank]

Just sayin
http://www.m.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/news/20140916/deaths-from-narcotic-painkillers-quadrupled-in-past-decade-cdc

[zeebo]

If you're gonna stop me from growing my own plant, then smoking that plant in the privacy of my own home, whilst peacefully watching cartoons and scarfing down cheese crunchies ... then fine, but stop waving the flag and telling me how damn free I am all the time.

[b_dubb]

But if pot's legal how is big pharma going to create wealth for shareholders and their board?

[eddie dean]

But if pot's legal how is big pharma going to create wealth for shareholders and their board?

Pot-Pills(tm)

[Catsmile]

Pot-Pills(tm)

MARINOL®

[Kelt]

If you're gonna stop me from growing my own plant, then smoking that plant in the privacy of my own home, whilst peacefully watching cartoons and scarfing down cheese crunchies ... then fine, but stop waving the flag and telling me how damn free I am all the time.

This whole, "Murca's the mostest free Cunnery in thu world" horseshit is horseshit.

Try smoking a joint, or drinking a beer on the street.  Try driving without a seatbelt, or getting into a fistfight. Try smoking in a restaurant, try making slightly too much noise at night.

There are laws prohibiting pretty much everything you might want to do, and not just in America but in all the Western nations.

I have a buddy from Bhutan.  In the little mountain town/village he came from they would grow their weed out in their yard, then throw it on their roof to dry.  Then they'd have all their year's supply of weed.  They could scream around town on their motorcycles, no license, no helmet, carrying a fucking PIG on the back if they felt like it/had to get a pig somewhere.

They would brew their own booze, have parties in the street, shoot their unregistered guns at the goats that wandered into their town periodically, no hunting license required.

Now admittedly Bhutan is an absolute shithole, but in terms of actual, genuine freedom... places like Bhutan piss on our imagined 'Freedoms'â,,¢.

Freedom decreases as governmental power increases. And one thing we have in the West is government with a stick up our arses, and on the end of that stick is a camera to make sure we don't do anything crazy like shout after 11pm, or set foot on private property.

When I retire it'll be to some mountain in some Third World Shithole.

Or Canada.

[Catsmile]

Just sayin
http://www.m.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/news/20140916/deaths-from-narcotic-painkillers-quadrupled-in-past-decade-cdc

Thats true.

But it won't bring back the brother I never had.
He died from a overdose the first time he injected 2 marijuanas.

[aldousburbank]

Try smoking a joint, or drinking a beer on the street.  Try driving without a seatbelt, or getting into a fistfight. Try smoking in a restaurant, try making slightly too much noise at night.

These things and more I did, today.
Let freedom ring. Try again if no answer.

[ksm32]

You know what I really love about marijuana?  It hobbles my competition.  Every other guitar tech I know smokes barnfulls of the stuff.  It kills their ambition and makes them complacent in their mediocrity.  It clouds their minds, dulls their judgement, and shrinks their penises.  I just love that.  Smoke up, suckers!

Over time it turns a 100 Watt bulb into a flickering 60 at best.  It works really hard on drummers and bass players.

[ksm32]

I, for the most part have nothing against the POT people. However, you folks always seem to be a little self righteous and love to point the negative finger at the drinking folk. They (we) don't do that to you.

[Catsmile]

Why is marijuana a "gateway drug?" Because some unscrupulous ambitious dealers have other illegal drugs for sell. These other "hard" drugs have higher profit margins, and are far more addictive. Hence making more profits, and more loyal customers, begetting more sales and faster profits. Almost any salesperson will try to sell you something extra, or up-sell a customer. Capitalism in action.

Being illegal there are no regulations, or standards in place. They don't have much to lose selling any quality to anyone as fast as possible. The goal is to earn some large magic dollar figure as fast as possible then quit selling drugs, before you get caught by the law. Want to make more profits, but have a limited resources? Not a problem. Use god knows what to cut the purity you can purchase, and double the amount you have for sell. Doubled your profit instantly. An environment where almost anything goes. Force anything into the black market, and you get your dream of a true unchecked Capitalism in action.

As a kid I was a peddler of tobacco, alcohol, caffeine, the legal "gateway drugs." During that time nobody ever asked if I could sell them illegal drugs, nor did I try to push any of the legal drugs we had to underage kids, no incentive, many consequences if you did. Selling in the open while government insured we were following the laws kept us from doing illegal things. It was imperative to follow the regulations put in place by government if we wanted to keep a good thing going. It was also imperative to the companies making the goods we sold to follow standards and regulations put in place if they wanted to stay in business. Government regulated Capitalism in action.

[Catsmile]

I, for the most part have nothing against the POT people. However, you folks always seem to be a little self righteous and love to point the negative finger at the drinking folk. They (we) don't do that to you.

Well, if you drinkers weren't so burnt out and unmotivated, you would point to their righteous indignation over others moral choices. Damn drug users look at the lot of you. 

And yes people who drink do point the negative finger at the POT people.
I've personally seen a large group of people with drink in hand do it.

[Yorkshire pud]

FWIW:


In the UK tobacco induced diseases cause about 80000 deaths a year (but it's falling). About 8500 directly to alcohol abuse, but doesn't include deaths from drink driving or injuries and deaths inflicted on a third party because of alcohol. That's an estimated 30000.

Cannabis deaths across the whole of the UK--24 , Heroin-- 533, Methadone---522...Paracetamol (mainly suicides)---about a 1000.

A great deal of narcotic induced death (prescription and none prescription) is accidental o/d. 

[SciFiAuthor]

I would never smoke pot. The giant transparent water bong with Carl Sagan's face embossed on it in my bedroom is for tobacco only. I can't help it if my girlfriend sticks other shit in there and I get a little woozy from her fucking resins. Sometimes a lot woozy, especially when she's not around and I've found her stash of resins. Butter really tastes kick ass after the resins.

That said, pot is one of the most lied about things on earth. They say it's a medication. Alright, the whole point of a medication is to reduce side effects, so let's alter it chemically so that creates apatite but without the intoxicating effects. Say that to medical marijuana proponents and 9 out of 10 of them will rip your fucking face off and piss on it so that can't be sewn back on without giving you an infection. This was never about medicine, it was about putting the foot in the door to make smoking a recreational doober legal.

Or another one; everyone says it's safe, except that it contains most of the same carcinogens as tobacco smoke.

Or that it doesn't affect motivation. It definitely affects motivation. I go from Mr. Motivated to a turd on the couch mounding tater chips into my mouth in all of five minutes on that shit. It even affects my Netflix viewing choices; "Fuck TED talks, put on Blazing Saddles".

Marijuana should be legalized on the basis that it is an intoxicant for recreational use that's no worse than already legal intoxicants like alcohol. It shouldn't be legalized on a bunch of shit that no one, deep down, buys. I fear that's how it's going to go down, and has in the legalized states. That just opens it up to criticism once it is legal.

Again, I say this from the POV of a non-smoker hoping to end the lies. Just end the lies. And just because whenever someone pulls a bud out of a sack I yell "Beef Jerky Time!" like Eddie Murphy in Trading Places, that doesn't make me a pot head. Or a liar. Fuck off if you think I lied.

[George Drooly]

Marijuana is for giggling, directionless pussies. The only drugs I care about are opiates, in particular Dilaudid.

[ksm32]

Well, if you drinkers weren't so burnt out and unmotivated, you would point to their righteous indignation over others moral choices. Damn drug users look at the lot of you. 

And yes people who drink do point the negative finger at the POT people.
I've personally seen a large group of people with drink in hand do it.

LOL, listen pussy I am far from an unmotivated drunk who can't get off his duff. (That is more often the POT PEOPLE)

From what I gather about you kind sir, is that you throw lonely BBQs and hug to death those regretful souls that actually suck it up and show up. I know you drink wine... So get off your soapbox. I say this with kindness in my heart.

[Catsmile]

LOL, listen pussy I am far from an unmotivated drunk who can't get off his duff. (That is more often the POT PEOPLE)

From what I gather about you kind sir, is that you throw lonely BBQs and hug to death those regretful souls that actually suck it up and show up. I know you drink wine... So get off your soapbox. I say this with kindness in my heart.

Ha, thats rich!
Goes to show how much you know about me, you think I drink, have friends, & BBQs.
I'm stuck here fappng to the ever so rare mudking pictures. Mudking porn... mmmmm 

[Catsmile]

http://www.webmd.com/osteoarthritis/features/are-nsaids-safe-for-you

Understanding NSAIDs (non-steroidal, anti-inflammatory drugs), such as over the counter aspirin.
According to the American Gastroenterological Association (AGA), each year the side effects of NSAIDs hospitalize over 100,000 people and kill 16,500 in the U.S., mostly due to bleeding stomach ulcers.

So much for reduced side effects theory, for drugs as medicine.
Any drug can have side effects, up to and including death.
Which leads me to ask, how many deaths from Cannabis overdose happen each year?

Cannabis isn't a magic bullet that will heal diseases, but it can help with symptoms of diseases, with relative safety. Many societies across many millennia have used Cannabis for rituals, medicine, and recreation. Only in recent history has it been deemed to have no therapeutic value, or any value to society. So much for thousands of years of safe usage by countless people, it's all anecdotal. Even though it has been shown to help some people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_cannabis

[aldousburbank]

[screed]
Yes, Cannabis can be medicinal for some people, debilitating for others. So what? Both of you get over it. It's a freekin plant. Screw your decrim and legalization AND medical exemption bullcrap. I'll grow buy snort or stick whatever plant in whatever of my own orifices that I choose, and whether you do or not, or whether you care that I do or not interests me less than who George is interviewing tonight. [\screed]