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President Donald J. Trump

Started by The General, February 11, 2011, 01:33:34 AM

Kidnostad3

Quote from: WOTR on June 23, 2018, 11:34:40 PM
I know... The death was a little strange (I don't recall specifics.  They were claiming suicide but the ME refused to sign off as such?)  Using McVeigh was just meant as a bit of a dig at somebody openly calling for civil war.

*Edit.  I just flipped through Wikipedia.  Even more screwed up than I recalled...

Your baseless association of McVeigh with those of us who support the President puts you in the camp of corrupt establishment politicians and government officials and the morally unencumbered leftist ideologues who support their efforts.  Given what has been established as fact concerning the 2016 election and the MSM’s record of militant bias and dishonesty in it’s reporting and the gratuitously vicious attacks on Trump and his family taking place everyday  this is no longer an issue upon which honest people can disagree.  One is either willing to accept a two tier justice system and multiple violations of law and the Constution by government officials or one is not. 



Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 01:19:22 AM
Most of the tariffs are agricultural.  I dislike our system of quotas for milk, chickens and cheese (it cost me more as a consumer)... But it keeps many of the farms as family farms instead of corporate farms.  Where I start getting really bothered is cheese and other "industrial milk products" where I cannot access excellent quality artisnial cheese at a reasonable price due to tariffs.

However, the USA dumps massive amounts of government money into agriculture (everything from corn for fuel to purchasing fruits and vegies for food banks.)  It is not really reasonable to think that small Canadian farms would manage competion form an industry so supported by financial cash injections by the us government. 

And these few million dollars of tariffs are really what he is going to start a trade war over?  I don't think so.  I think it is more because it is popular with his base (and for that, I don't fault him.)  However, he is doing things in a very strange manner.  For instance, the steel tariff imposes additional costs on raw steel and not manufactured goods (one would think if you are looking to protect American manufacturing, you would tax the finished product from other nations.)  Here is an interesting take from the last American keg manufacturer... https://www.marketplace.org/2018/03/16/business/last-american-keg-company-says-tariffs-come-unintended-consequences

Taxing the finished product isn't going to give us our steel industry back and that's the ultimate goal for national security reasons. Anyway, either you're a free trade globalist or you're not. If you are then you need follow though on that and if you're not then you understand the tarrifs.

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: Kidnostad3 on June 24, 2018, 01:24:38 AM
Your baseless association of McVeigh with those of us who support the President puts you in the camp of corrupt establishment politicians and government officials and the morally unencumbered leftist ideologues who support their efforts.  Given what has been established as fact concerning the 2016 election and the MSM’s record of militant bias and dishonesty in it’s reporting and gratuitous vicious attacks on Trump and his family, this is no longer an issue upon which honest people can disagree.  One is either willing to accept a two tier justice system and multiple violations of law and the Constution by government officials or one is not.


Jojo

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 12:26:33 AM
You will have no trouble finding the "anti Trump" rhetoric.  Just look to my last post.  I want you to find all of this "anti American rhetoric" you seem to think I spout.  Sorry- but my disagreeing with you does not automatically make it "anti-American."

For fun, I think I'll hit on the trade crap that has been in the news lately. Again- I realize that Trump campaigned against NAFTA- so in one way I applaud him for following through on his promise.   

However, I can tell you that when I bought a pair of Redwing shoes and found a "made in China" tag in them, I returned them and wrote the company.  I then bought a pair made in the USA at roughly twice the price.  My newest pair (not Redwing) is made in Winnipeg, Canada.  When suddenly my Carhartt's had a "made in Mexico" tag sewn in, I wrote them and informed them that if production was not returned to the USA, they had lost a customer. Yes, I spend more for products made in a country by labor that I want to support.

I have been thinking a little since this whole trade thing started.  When Carhartt moved their production to Mexico, my cost on a pair of pants dropped around $20.  I still would not buy them as it pissed me off that a company with their history who claimed to be so proud of being American would move production out of country.  Then they moved production (of black and brown) pants back to the USA.  My cost went up, and I buy mostly black pants (and the occasional brown) even though I prefer grey (grey is still made in Mexico.)

It is almost time to purchase a couple new pair.  I honestly don't know if I will just buy the grey pants this time.  Does it really matter if I support American jobs and American families when the president is busy painting Canada as an enemy?  Why not just buy what I like, go for the better price, and be done with it? 

There is your "anti-American" rhetoric.  Somebody who refused to support companies who did not support Americans.  (Granted, I now admit that I don't know if I should continue caring if it is "Bill" making my pants in Tennessee, or if I should support "Jose" making my pants in Tijuana.)
When I was able to, I only shopped at union stores, as best possible.  I think it helps.

Offshoring to other countries wrecked a lot of jobs.  I appreciate what you've been doing.  Since offshoring, I have felt like a migrant worker.  I have been routinely sent home early, arrived to "cancelled" shifts, worked in over 82 degrees routinely in many indoor businesses, routinely shared headsets, had to buy my own headset, to pay for my own food handler's card, to clean houses, to commute for three-hour shifts, to have TWO interviews for minimum wage positions, to watch pregnant coworkers toss their cookies in the waste basket, to bring my own toilet paper, to endure unsafe working conditions, to work in spider-infested areas, to watch employees getting high in the restroom and drinking and passing out on the job... None of these things EVER used to happen in my world.  You definitely help if you can support US businesses even if ordering onoine is cheaper then.

Fourteen 'n berry picking, baby-sittin' and paper routes

WOTR

Quote from: Kidnostad3 on June 24, 2018, 01:24:38 AM
Your baseless association of McVeigh with those of us who support the President puts you in the camp of corrupt establishment politicians and government officials and the morally unencumbered leftist ideologues who support their efforts. 
Did you even read what that was in response to?
Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 22, 2018, 10:32:59 PM
They need to be stomped down and stomped down hard! ;)
I don't think that MD was referring to stomping on them with words, but with violence (if I'm mistaken, I actually apologize to MD.)  Hence the response.  Nothing to do with Trump... Everything to do with somebody calling for violence against those who disagree with him.  If you want, you can equate McVeigh and my post with ANTFIA.  Same coin of hatred and intolerance, different sides.

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 01:47:54 AM
Did you even read what that was in response to?I don't think that MD was referring to stomping on them with words, but with violence (if I'm mistaken, I actually apologize to MD.)  Hence the response.  Nothing to do with Trump... Everything to do with somebody calling for violence against those who disagree with him.  If you want, you can equate McVeigh and my post with ANTFIA.  Same coin of hatred and intolerance, different sides.

Sorry, did you guys shoot Steve Scalise with words?! When you call someone a Nazi you're basically giving people license to do violence against them. This isn't stopping. It's intensifying. Would you prefer if we all just roll over now?!  ???

Maybe it's time for you to grow up now? ::)

WOTR

Quote from: 14 on June 24, 2018, 01:36:52 AM
When I was able to, I only shopped at union stores, as best possible.  I think it helps.

Offshoring to other countries wrecked a lot of jobs. 
It's funny you mention that.  It is exactly how I feel.  I have watched wages stagnate and conditions get worse.  Canada actually has a foreign worker program (so we not only get to compete for jobs that can be sent off shore, but now we even get to compete with foreign workers who can survive on $5 a day for our jobs that have to be done in this country.)  Things have not been getting better.

I suppose that is a part of the reason that I tried to buy Canadian or American... I still hold out hope that not everybody should have to work for minimum wage in a Walmart selling Chinese produced junk.

There is no industry where standards have not gotten worse over the last decade.  But we all buy from Amazon who drive their workers like slaves and squeeze every penny out of their suppliers and contractors who in turn squeeze their employees.  It is not something that I see ending.

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 01:56:48 AM
It's funny you mention that.  It is exactly how I feel.  I have watched wages stagnate and conditions get worse.  Canada actually has a foreign worker program (so we not only get to compete for jobs that can be sent off shore, but now we even get to compete with foreign workers who can survive on $5 a day for our jobs that have to be done in this country.)  Things have not been getting better.

I suppose that is a part of the reason that I tried to buy Canadian or American... I still hold out hope that not everybody should have to work for minimum wage in a Walmart selling Chinese produced junk.

There is no industry where standards have not gotten worse over the last decade.  But we all buy from Amazon who drive their workers like slaves and squeeze every penny out of their suppliers and contractors who in turn squeeze their employees.  It is not something that I see ending.

Buzz...click....I'm a zombie robot who has no choice...no control...buzz...click.... ;D

WOTR

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 01:53:52 AM
Sorry, did you guys shoot Steve Scalise with words?! When you call someone a Nazi you're basically giving people license to do violence against them. This isn't stopping. It's intensifying. Would you prefer if we all just roll over now?!  ???

Maybe it's time for you to grow up now? ::)

Fuck you are special snowflakes.  Yup. When I'm not out shooting congressmen, I'm referring to you and others here as Nazi's.

Heil Hitler.


Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 02:00:28 AM
Fuck you are special snowflakes.  Yup. When I'm not out shooting congressmen, I'm referring to you and others here as Nazi's.

Heil Hitler.



Yep, like I said earlier, you can suck a bag of dicks now, globalist cuck. ::)

WOTR

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 02:01:58 AM
Yep, like I said earlier, you can suck a bag of dicks now, globalist cuck. ::)
Go sit on your big, black boyfriend, MD (not that threes anything wrong with that...)

I suppose now that it has devolved to name calling, Nazis, bags of dicks and black boyfriends, we can pretty much call it a successful conversation and call it a night?  :-*




Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 02:04:48 AM
Go sit on your big, black boyfriend, MD (not that threes anything wrong with that...)

I suppose now that it has devolved to name calling, Nazis, bags of dicks and black boyfriends, we can pretty much call it a successful conversation and call it a night?  :-*

You have zero credibility and probably the same amount morals. I really don't believe anything you say anymore. So, now that you been completely bested you have resort to name calling. Really pathetic, Cancuck! ::)

WOTR

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 02:08:46 AM
You have zero credibility and probably the same amount morals. I really don't believe anything you say anymore. So, now that you been completely bested you have resort to name calling. Really pathetic, Cancuck! ::)
Don't believe what I say ANYMORE?  Good to know that up until tonight you shared the same belief in what I say and reverence for me as I have for you.  ;)

It is also good to see that resorting to name calling means that you have been bested.

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 02:01:58 AM
Yep, like I said earlier, you can suck a bag of dicks now, globalist cuck. ::)
G'night, snowflake.  :D

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 02:14:08 AM
Don't believe what I say ANYMORE?  Good to know that up until tonight you shared the same belief in what I say and reverence towards me as I have towards you.  ;)

It is also good to see that resorting to name calling means that you have been bested.
G'night, snowflake.  :D

Fuck you, you globalist shitheel!


Jojo

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 01:56:48 AM
It's funny you mention that.  It is exactly how I feel.  I have watched wages stagnate and conditions get worse.  Canada actually has a foreign worker program (so we not only get to compete for jobs that can be sent off shore, but now we even get to compete with foreign workers who can survive on $5 a day for our jobs that have to be done in this country.)  Things have not been getting better.

I suppose that is a part of the reason that I tried to buy Canadian or American... I still hold out hope that not everybody should have to work for minimum wage in a Walmart selling Chinese produced junk.

There is no industry where standards have not gotten worse over the last decade.  But we all buy from Amazon who drive their workers like slaves and squeeze every penny out of their suppliers and contractors who in turn squeeze their employees.  It is not something that I see ending.
Here, their workers can't carry a cell phone while tasking bec it will be presumed the phone is stolen merchandise.  At least that's what I heard one young lady say to another while we waited in line.  She said they can't have anything personal on them.  Creepy.  To have to ask special permission to carry an inhaler!

Fourteen

Jojo

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 02:16:21 AM
Fuck you, you globalist ...
Are you sure he's a globalist?  Bec it sounds like he wants to keep production and service in the USA.

Now go easy, I'm tired.

Fourteen

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: 14 on June 24, 2018, 02:35:43 AM
Are you sure he's a globalist?  Bec it sounds like he wants to keep production and service in the USA.

Now go easy, I'm tired.

Fourteen

Yes! It's just one of his little games because if he really was what he says he is he surely would've spoken critically of the left's calls for violence against the right but on this he remains mute...unless called out by someone like me and then he's all,  Whoa! You got me all wrong. it's a little too convenient, don't you think? ::)

Jojo

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 02:42:29 AM
Yes! It's just one of his little games because if he really was what he says he is he surely would've spoken critically of the left's calls for violence against the right but on this he remains mute...unless called out by someone like me and then he's all,  Whoa! You got me all wrong. it's a little too convenient, don't you think? ::)
Geez, I thought only extremists incited violence. And I couldn't tell if he was being sarcastic on the violence thing.  Inciting violence is never good!  Did you get bread?

Fourteen

Jojo

Kinda hard to talk to a guy in a gas mask anyhow.  No nonverbal cues! 

Richard missed two breaks on Coast tonight!  He was engrossed.  His producer had to prod him! I wonder what the ad dept's gonna do.  Issue a refund??

Fourteen

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: 14 on June 24, 2018, 02:47:50 AM
Geez, I thought only extremists incited violence. And I couldn't tell if he was being sarcastic on the violence thing.  Inciting violence is never good!  Did you get bread?

Fourteen

Yes, he's always sarcastic about conservative issues but never liberal and I wasn't saying he's inciting the violence, just tacitly going along with it...until he's called out about the hypocrisy and then he does a quick about face. It's disingenuous to say the least.

Jojo

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 03:07:40 AM
Yes, he's always sarcastic about conservative issues but never liberal and I wasn't saying he's inciting the violence, just tacitly going along with it...until he's called out about the hypocrisy and then he does a quick about face. It's disingenuous to say the least.
You are describing bias.  Bias sucks.  I'll take stats and metrics any day over bias.  Even bias on personal levels bothers me.  I find bias in myself, and I don't understand it.  Bias is never fully accurate and is so untruthful as to be self-delusion.  I HATE BIAS.  Where does it come from?  How does it take root?  It is so lacking in truth.  I just can't understand how bias can happen to me, someone very fair and impartial.  But I fall for my own biases all the time, until the truth shows up.  That's my opinion.

Ordinarily, I'm leery of AI.  But, being unbiased (so far) is one good thing about AI.  It is possible to have good, unbiased AI. 

Fourteen

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: 14 on June 24, 2018, 03:18:11 AM
You are describing bias.  Bias sucks.  I'll take stats and metrics any day over bias.  Even bias on personal levels bothers me.  I find bias in myself, and I don't understand it.  Bias is never fully accurate and is so untruthful as to be self-delusion.  I HATE BIAS.  Where does it come from?  How does it take root?  It is so lacking in truth.  I just can't understand how bias can happen to me, someone very fair and impartial.  But I fall for my own biases all the time, until the truth shows up.  That's my opinion.

Ordinarily, I'm leery of AI.  But, being unbiased (so far) is one good thing about AI.  It is possible to have good, unbiased AI. 

Fourteen

You always seem to manage to draw the wrong conclusions to what I'm saying. ::)

Jojo

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 03:20:46 AM
You always seem to manage to draw the wrong conclusions to what I'm saying. ::)
Eat some food with your whiskey :D! Oh, and sorry  ;)!  WOTR should not remain silent about violence when it is convenient to his argument.  And he should not be any more sarcastic to one side than the other.  He would not have made the cut on your Debate Team!  You do, though, lump individuals into their larger groups. I guess that's fair, but each person is just one facet, with latitude.  Or attitude  :).

Fourteen

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: 14 on June 24, 2018, 03:34:05 AM
Eat some food with your whiskey :D! Oh, and sorry  ;)!  WOTR should not remain silent about violence when it is convenient to his argument.  And he should not be any more sarcastic to one side than the other.  He would not have made the cut on your Debate Team!  You do, though, lump individuals into their larger groups. I guess that's fair, but each person is just one facet, with latitude.  Or attitude  :).

Fourteen

I rarely if ever drink alcohol and I've had plenty to eat, thanks. I haven't lumped anyone. I deal with people on a case by case basis. Truth be told, I figure you're just a liberal troll too but at least you're attempting to be clever and subtle about it.  ;)

WOTR

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 02:42:29 AM
Yes! It's just one of his little games because if he really was what he says he is he surely would've spoken critically of the left's calls for violence against the right but on this he remains mute...unless called out by someone like me and then he's all,  Whoa! You got me all wrong. it's a little too convenient, don't you think? ::)
Oh, you big man you... Taking me on and putting me in my place.  ::)

The problem is that I'm not as far right as you.  Therefore, I am a globalist, communist, fucker by your standards.  I'm critical of the left- but it does not seem like this place is in need of another voice attacking Paul Artidies.  Also, I see no point to attack the far left as it is like attacking a group of clowns who are already too discredited to bother with. 

That said, Paul was not here today calling for what appears to be a civil war and stomping the other side into oblivion.  That was you (and it is far from the first time.)  I know you are not going to like my views on the extremes of politics- but I don't consider it a straight line with the left on one side, and the right on the other.  I consider it more of a ring with a gap in it where the extreme "left" and the extreme "right" are pretty close to each other in fruitcake, snowflake land...

***I found a picture that comes close.  Until now, I had not really considered the space between left and right as "anarchy."  I have to give it a little more thought...  I used to say that what scares people on the far right / far left is that they can look across a small gap in their ideologies to the far left / far right and see their own reflection... Do you see a glimmer of yourself in the eyes of your average ANTIFA member screaming about their views and wanting "stomp" out those who hold views that they disagree with?


Jojo

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 04:06:42 AM
Oh, you big man you... Taking me on and putting me in my place.  ::)

The problem is that I'm not as far right as you.  Therefore, I am a globalist, communist, fucker by your standards.  I'm critical of the left- but it does not seem like this place is in need of another voice attacking Paul Artidies.  Also, I see no point to attack the far left as it is like attacking a group of clowns who are already too discredited to bother with. 

That said, Paul was not here today calling for what appears to be a civil war and stomping the other side into oblivion.  That was you.  I know you are not going to like my views on the extremes of politics- but I don't consider it a straight line with the left on one side, and the right on the other.  I consider it more of a ring with a gap in it where the extreme "left" and the extreme "right" are pretty close to each other in fruitcake, snowflake land...

***I found a picture that comes close.  Until now, I had not really considered the space between left and right as "anarchy."  I have to give it a little more thought...  I used to say that what scares people on the far right / far left is that they can look across a small gap in their ideologies to the far left / far right and see their own reflection... Do you see a glimmer of yourself in the eyes of your average ANTIFA member screaming about their views and wanting "stomp" out those who hold views that they disagree with?


How dare you be an individual!

Hey, that graph.  I used to know a guy who was mere inches from me on that graph, but you could not get there from here..  Like each of us was near the top of the U shape but neither would cross the gap.

Fourteen

Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 04:06:42 AM
Oh, you big man you... Taking me on and putting me in my place.  ::)

The problem is that I'm not as far right as you.  Therefore, I am a globalist, communist, fucker by your standards.  I'm critical of the left- but it does not seem like this place is in need of another voice attacking Paul Artidies.  Also, I see no point to attack the far left as it is like attacking a group of clowns who are already too discredited to bother with. 

That said, Paul was not here today calling for what appears to be a civil war and stomping the other side into oblivion.  That was you (and it is far from the first time.)  I know you are not going to like my views on the extremes of politics- but I don't consider it a straight line with the left on one side, and the right on the other.  I consider it more of a ring with a gap in it where the extreme "left" and the extreme "right" are pretty close to each other in fruitcake, snowflake land...

***I found a picture that comes close.  Until now, I had not really considered the space between left and right as "anarchy."  I have to give it a little more thought...  I used to say that what scares people on the far right / far left is that they can look across a small gap in their ideologies to the far left / far right and see their own reflection... Do you see a glimmer of yourself in the eyes of your average ANTIFA member screaming about their views and wanting "stomp" out those who hold views that they disagree with?



Dr. MD MD

Quote from: WOTR on June 24, 2018, 04:06:42 AM
Oh, you big man you... Taking me on and putting me in my place.  ::)

The problem is that I'm not as far right as you.  Therefore, I am a globalist, communist, fucker by your standards.  I'm critical of the left- but it does not seem like this place is in need of another voice attacking Paul Artidies.  Also, I see no point to attack the far left as it is like attacking a group of clowns who are already too discredited to bother with. 

That said, Paul was not here today calling for what appears to be a civil war and stomping the other side into oblivion.  That was you.  I know you are not going to like my views on the extremes of politics- but I don't consider it a straight line with the left on one side, and the right on the other.  I consider it more of a ring with a gap in it where the extreme "left" and the extreme "right" are pretty close to each other in fruitcake, snowflake land...

***I found a picture that comes close.  Until now, I had not really considered the space between left and right as "anarchy."  Funny, as that might be where I actually reside given my punk past...  I used to say that what scares people on the far right / far left is that they can look across a small gap in their ideologies to the far left / far right and see their own reflection... Do you see a glimmer of yourself in the eyes of your average ANTIFA member screaming about their views and wanting "stomp" out those who hold views that they disagree with?



Yeah...sure...you're just trying to provide balance to the discussion. ::)

No, I don't see myself as being in any way similar to Antifa but I do believe that people have a right to defend themselves and that sometimes when you're dealing with a highly unstable enemy who refuses to let up the best defense may be a good offense. Now, do you think you could cease your white knighting on behalf of the left here and get real? Would ya? You need to check your hypocrisy. It's out of control! ::)

Jojo

Quote from: Dr. MD MD on June 24, 2018, 03:52:35 AM
I rarely if ever drink alcohol and I've had plenty to eat, thanks. I haven't lumped anyone. I deal with people on a case by case basis. Truth be told, I figure you're just a liberal troll too but at least you're attempting to be clever and subtle about it.  ;)
Okay, I'm glad to hear that.  I had a dream you were guzzling at night.  I'm only trolling for more guys to add to the collection in my closet, and you know it!  Really, I'm not even clear on the definition of liberal anymore.  Yes you do give individual attention and we soak it up!  I'm not a troll.  When I get a job, this'll all come to a standstill.  But I would troll if it was ok with the rules and if it was 19 hours per week and if it paid $15/hour.  Or less hours and higher wage of course.

Fourteen

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