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President Donald J. Trump

Started by The General, February 11, 2011, 01:33:34 AM

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Metron2267 on June 08, 2018, 05:26:13 PM
He didn't take any wind out of her sails, that was all her dragon lady persona that undid her.
I'm sure the Comey press conference added to her defeat.. You know the way that negative news released just before an election can work? Say just as possibly the disclosure that Trump had been having affairs with two playboy models and a porn actress might have been negative for Trump..(Hypothetically).

Quote
By whom and for what?

He just said the election was rigged.. He didn't say by whom, just that it was against him. That being the case something didn't pan out...So maybe he meant it was rigged in his favour, as it turned out to be...
Comey sure had no respect for him, nor did the rest of the deep staters.

Quote
Try again.

It looks like the rust belt 'rigged' an election by showing up to VOTE Republican!


No, not them...But it's good you mention them, how are the mothballed steel plants turning over these days? How many tons of steel are they producing today?  :-\

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Jackstar on June 08, 2018, 04:23:29 PM

Jesus Christ, it's like you're some kind of research wizard. Awe-inspiring! But, wait--where are the links to sources?





I'm leaning towards the conclusion that Trump and Daniels are in fact working together, and the entire story is a psyop to conveniently distract from talking about anything important. Note, that I was vetting this conclusion before Dipshit started doubling down on his hardcore fact-finding investigative forum mission from his armchair. Circumstantial of course, yet--compelling.


Holy chemtrails flowerboy, you're right!!!! They know who shot all the Kennedys!!  >:(





Juan

What will you Trump haters/lovers do when you find out Trump sleeps with Kim Yo-jong in Singapore?


Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 08, 2018, 06:22:09 PM

Wow, you really do have your finger on the pulse! Why would he imagine that? Trump was yet to congratulate him and later tell him looked forward to 'working with him'.. Of course it didn't turn out like that, and when Flynn was fired because he was an undeclared foreign agent and the FBI started to take notice, Trump wanted Comey to lay off Flynn, Comey refused, Trump fired Comey because of that, which was the first time he obstructed justice. And if only he hadn't, Mueller wouldn't have been given the job he has...  ???

You really do embrace proxy thinking, don't you?

It must be a real mind-saver to simply let the media write you a script and then mouth it back, almost like a secular version of singing hymns...

I have little hope that I'll ever read anything original from you and I think you're fine with that, even proud of it.

Sad.

:(

Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 08, 2018, 06:25:24 PM

Nope...try again.

No need, I'm on the money as always.


QuoteWhat? She's not of good character because she's a porn performer and is honest about it...And Trump is good character even though he's cheated all his life, founded a fake university, money laundered.....Oh you have a warped sense of 'character'.  ;D

And yet I have never once said nor even intimated that he is of "good character" so the straw man factory just keeps cranking out replicant rhetoric.

The irony of it is that you do so from some fictional mortal high ground while simultaneously sleeping with the most corrupt political machine in history, the Clinton Global Graft machine.

It's really quite mad.

QuoteAs opposed to the current POTUS and his family currently cashing in on him being POTUS?

Have they sold off our uranium?

QuoteNope, but that doesn't stop you being a dipshit cultist.  ;)

A "cultist" who somehow states that Trump would never get a dinner invite or place at my table?

How's that work anyway?

Delude much?

:o

Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 08, 2018, 06:30:07 PM


Don't take this the wrong way, you're a gullible idiot. Stay off the bong. Trump is fucking the US economy. Sure he's close to China after he said they were the enemy, and he's pissing off US allies, but here's the deal..It won't work in the US favour. Take a note of the targeted tariffs that those allies are imposing in retaliation... And where geographically they target in the USA... It's clever stuff.  :-\

No you're right, we're much better off losing all our manufacturing capacities, letting Iran launder money through our banks, and being a population dumping ground for Mexico and Central America.

I don't know why I haven't seen the beauty in our terminal decay, but you've convinced me, you limey sot - we must HELP America to DIE!

Can I do my sanctuary city happy dance now?

>:(


Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 08, 2018, 06:35:56 PM
I'm sure the Comey press conference added to her defeat.. You know the way that negative news released just before an election can work? Say just as possibly the disclosure that Trump had been having affairs with two playboy models and a porn actress might have been negative for Trump..(Hypothetically).

Steele dossier, FBI spies, Russian rumors, etc.

Checkmate.


QuoteHe just said the election was rigged.. He didn't say by whom, just that it was against him. That being the case something didn't pan out...So maybe he meant it was rigged in his favour, as it turned out to be...

Rigged in his favor by WHOM???

Come on, spit it out you rhetoric and rumor laden tapeworm!

QuoteComey sure had no respect for him, nor did the rest of the deep staters.

Only the rust belt voters it would seem...oh those bitter ,gun clinging, unemployed ex-factory tossers, eh wot?


QuoteNo, not them...But it's good you mention them, how are the mothballed steel plants turning over these days? How many tons of steel are they producing today?  :-\

I love it when you feed me easy layups:

https://www.infowars.com/trump-effect-us-steel-reopens-plant-brings-back-500-jobs/

US Steel CEO David Burritt credited President Trump’s tariffs for prompting the reopening of an idled plant in Illinois.
“This feels like the beginning of a renaissance for us,” Burritt told CNBC Wednesday.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3ODZRuh4iU

Owen Shroyer celebrates the reopening of steel plants across America thanks to President Trump.

;D ;D ;D

Metron2267

Quote from: Juan on June 09, 2018, 06:40:18 AM
What will you Trump haters/lovers do when you find out Trump sleeps with Kim Yo-jong in Singapore?

Mix up a dark and stormy and relax... :P

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Metron2267 on June 09, 2018, 09:47:47 AM


https://www.infowars.com/trump-effect-us-steel-reopens-plant-brings-back-500-jobs/

US Steel CEO David Burritt credited President Trump’s tariffs for prompting the reopening of an idled plant in Illinois.
“This feels like the beginning of a renaissance for us,” Burritt told CNBC Wednesday.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3ODZRuh4iU

Owen Shroyer celebrates the reopening of steel plants across America thanks to President Trump.

;D ;D ;D


You know don't you that Trump has sold you a bum steer? He's given you the impression that steel has been declining in the US only because China has been making it cheaper...Nope. Steel plants that are closed won't be resurrected, not because of China, but because they're not needed. Trump has nothing to do with it, and why would he? Is he increasing the subsidies in this free market economy? My my, how the GOP must be biting their nails at that one, subsidies are a very socialist philosophy to keep people in jobs that the company can't afford to do any other way.. (Refer you to Margaret Thatcher in the early 1980s removing subsidies to British Steel and the subsequent massive job losses because of it)..

Here's the reason that jobs in steel have declined in the USA:

Quote
If you believe that steel jobs would come back to the U.S. if â€" and only if â€" China started behaving as a perfect free-market economy and was a free-trade role model, there is this:

In the 1980s, American steelmakers needed 10.1 man-hours to produce a ton of steel; now they need 1.5 man-hours, says Joe Innace of S&P Global Platts.

Have you seen steel factories these days?

Most American steel is now made at super-efficient mini mills, which use electric arc furnaces to turn scrap metal into steel. (Traditional integrated steel mills make steel from scratch, feeding iron ore and coking coal into blast furnaces.) Some mini-mills need just 0.5 man-hours to produce a ton of steel, Innace says.

This explains why steel employment peeked in 1953 at 650,000 and stands at 143,000 today.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/the-u-s-steel-industry-a-reality-check/

Alex Jones isn't your friend, he's a part time Trump bitch.  :-\


I'd also add that tariffs will only make products more expensive for the consumer. They won't hurt the foreign manufacturer, and they'll also hurt the US firms exporting abroad because guess what; The other countries retaliate with their tariffs on US goods and services. Trump neither knows this or cares, why would he? He's lived in a bubble all his life without the need to consider anyone but himself.

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Juan on June 09, 2018, 06:40:18 AM
What will you Trump haters/lovers do when you find out Trump sleeps with Kim Yo-jong in Singapore?

I imagine she has better taste. A fat bloke with a very dodgy haircut can't be her squeeze of choice twice can it?

ACE of CLUBS

Quote from: Yorkshire pudI'd also add that tariffs will only make products more expensive for the consumer. They won't hurt the foreign manufacturer, and they'll also hurt the US firms exporting abroad because guess what; The other countries retaliate with their tariffs on US goods and services. Trump neither knows this or cares, why would he? He's lived in a bubble all his life without the need to consider anyone but himself.

Trump has 'thrown the bone' to the American consumer .....
We will do well regardless .....
No big deal.

Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 09, 2018, 10:16:59 AM
You know don't you that Trump has sold you a bum steer? He's given you the impression that steel has been declining in the US only because China has been making it cheaper...Nope.

Not only making it cheaper, and they have for at least the past ten years, but also dumping product from lower cost plants around the world:

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/china-steel-now-as-cheap-as-cabbage-weighing-on-global-price-2014-10-13

The average price for the range of steel products on offer has fallen to 3,212 yuan ($520) per metric ton for the first half of the year, down 28% from the average price in 2012, CISA data showed.

“Sharply slowing steel demand growth in an oversupplied sector is the key reason for China’s currently low steel prices,” CIMB analysts said in a recent note.

Standard & Poor’s also cited Chinese oversupply as the largest headache for steel makers in the rest of Asia, and is likely to remain so.

http://www.industryweek.com/environment/viewpoint-why-china-cheaper

Above all, there is the ever-present currency manipulation, where China undervalues their currency by an estimated 30%-40%, which simply makes every product that China ships out 30-40% cheaper than those of a potential American competitor.

Finally, China has a national strategy of what is called "dumping." "Dumping" is defined as the act of a manufacturer in one country exporting a product to another country at a price that is either below the price it charges in its home market or is below its cost of production. The goal of "dumping" is to capture the market or destroy the competition for a particular product or commodity so the price to the end user or consumer is lowered way below the competition, often below cost. "Dumping" is one of the strategies China uses as a neomercantilist country. Neomercantilism is a term used to describe a policy which encourages exports, discourages imports, controls capital movement and centralizes currency decisions in the hands of a central government.

QuoteSteel plants that are closed won't be resurrected, not because of China, but because they're not needed.

So "not needed" that Europeon steel maker Arcellor-Mital has major steel operations in the US?

http://www.usa.arcelormittal.com

ArcelorMittal is one of the largest steelmakers in North America and serves a broad U.S. manufacturing base. In the United States, ArcelorMittal owns and operates 26 facilities, including mines, integrated steelmaking facilities, mini-mills and finishing operations.

In the U.S., we employ more than 18,000 people with industrial operations in 12 states and a presence in 14 states and the District of Columbia.

ArcelorMittal USA is part of ArcelorMittal, the world’s largest steel and mining company. ArcelorMittal formed in 2006 when the world's largest steel company, Mittal Steel Company N.V., merged with the Arcelor S.A., the second largest. Today, ArcelorMittal has approximately 199,000 employees across 60 countries.

QuoteTrump has nothing to do with it, and why would he?

US Steel begs to differ:

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/07/us-steel-reopening-plant-and-bringing-back-jobs-ceo-on-trump-tariffs.html

US Steel CEO: We're reopening an idled plant and bringing back 500 jobs due to Trump tariffs
We're excited "to tell our employees in the community in Granite City, Illinois, that we will be calling back 500 employees," says CEO David Burritt.
Burritt says the facility had been idle since December 2015 because of what he called unfair trade practices.

QuoteIs he increasing the subsidies in this free market economy? My my, how the GOP must be biting their nails at that one, subsidies are a very socialist philosophy to keep people in jobs that the company can't afford to do any other way.. (Refer you to Margaret Thatcher in the early 1980s removing subsidies to British Steel and the subsequent massive job losses because of it)..

You even lie about your own nation, unsurprising that!

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/3509/the_truth_about_thatcher_and_the_steel_industry

And it wasn't long before Steel broke out the Big Lie: "in 1980 Margaret Thatcher’s government shut down most of the steel industry, as part of her plan to break the unions". You hear this argument a lot, as though repeating it will make it true. But a look at the facts shows that it isn’t.

In 1955 the British steel industry was working at 98 percent of capacity. But, over the following years, this declined as a result of its failure to adopt new methods (such as the basic oxygen steel-making process and continuous casting) and increased steel production in other countries. By 1966 just 79 percent of capacity was being utilised.

The following year a large chunk of the British steel industry was renationalised (it had been nationalised for a few years in the early 1950s). In 1970 the new British Steel had a record output of 23.8 million tonnes (4.7 percent of the world total, down from 25 percent in 1929).

But the industry was now being run for political rather than economic ends and massive over-manning and consequent low productivity became endemic. By 1977 output had actually fallen to 20 million tonnes (3 percent of the world total). By 1978 British Steel was operating at just two-thirds capacity. And by 1979, British steel workers were a third less productive than their French competitors and 40 percent less productive than West German steel workers.

In the fiscal year 1978-1979 British Steel lost £309 million. This rose to £545 million the following year, one in which workers struck for six weeks for a 20 percent pay rise. They got it, but my dad, who worked in a steel works in Sheffield at the time, said that by the time they went back to work their foreign customers had gone elsewhere.

In 1980-1981, British Steel lost a staggering £1 billion on turnover of £3 billion, earning itself a place in the Guinness Book of Records. By contrast the output of Britain's small private sector steel industry doubled between 1967 and 1979, from 3 million tonnes to 6 million tonnes.

Between 1967 and 1974 employment in the British steel industry fell from 250,000 to 197,000. And by 1990 it had fallen again by 74 percent to 51,000. But other developed countries also saw drastic declines in employment in their steel industries in the same period. In France, for example, employment fell by 70 percent, while in the United States it fell by 60 percent. Even Germany lost 46 percent of its steel workforce.

What happened to towns like Sheffield or Corby was not part of some Thatcherite vendetta and instead was part of a general trend across the industrialised world. It happened in the Rhur Valley and Ohio, was Maggie Thatcher responsible for that too?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/industry/engineering/11941457/Margaret-Thatcher-would-never-have-let-the-steel-industry-collapse.html

British Steel, as it was then, was competing with foreign companies, some that were nationalised and subsidised. If the Government had acted as if it were in a free market it would have had to let British Steel go under. Instead, it gave state aid to allow the firm to get back to fighting fitness.

QuoteHere's the reason that jobs in steel have declined in the USA:

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/the-u-s-steel-industry-a-reality-check/


Garbage!

China has been buying up steel plants globally to evade dumping restrictions:

http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/06/news/economy/us-steel-vietnam-china-tariffs/index.html

The U.S. is slapping heavy taxes on steel imports from Vietnam, saying China is using the country as a way to dodge earlier penalties.
Certain steel products Vietnam is selling to the U.S. are being produced from Chinese materials, the U.S. Department of Commerce said in a statement late Tuesday.
American steelmakers complained last year that Chinese companies appeared to be avoiding huge tariffs by diverting products to Vietnam for "minor processing" before they were shipped to the U.S.


QuoteAlex Jones isn't your friend, he's a part time Trump bitch.  :-\

Predictable leftard "shoot the messenger" action in lieu of factual rebuttal.

QuoteI'd also add that tariffs will only make products more expensive for the consumer.

Short term yes...mid term maybe, long term no.

QuoteThey won't hurt the foreign manufacturer,

That's utterly illogical.

Anything that drives up their costs will of course hurt them.

WTF is wrong with your brain?

Quoteand they'll also hurt the US firms exporting abroad because guess what; The other countries retaliate with their tariffs on US goods and services.

Short term!

QuoteTrump neither knows this or cares, why would he?

So you can read his mind?

Some trick that...

QuoteHe's lived in a bubble all his life without the need to consider anyone but himself.

Ya think?

A "bubble" called the high stakes global and domestic market property development and construction business ?

Of course he only considers "himself" when having to negotiate with multiple private and governmental entities, I mean that's logical reasoning, isn't it?

You apparently haven't a single neuron correlated with reality or the facts.

It's really mental of you.

:-\


Metron2267

Quote from: ACE of CLUBS on June 09, 2018, 10:48:38 AM
Trump has 'thrown the bone' to the American consumer .....
We will do well regardless .....
No big deal.

Canuckistan will pay, trust me!

https://www.lmtonline.com/news/article/Trump-floats-end-to-all-tariffs-threatens-major-12981080.php

QUEBEC CITY - President Donald Trump told foreign leaders at the Group of Seven summit that they must dramatically reduce trade barriers with the United States or they would risk losing access to the world's largest economy, delivering his most defiant trade threat yet to his counterparts from around the globe.

Trump, in a news conference before leaving for Singapore, described private conversations he held over two days with the leaders of Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and Canada. He said he pushed them to consider removing every single tariff or trade barrier on American goods, and in return he would do the same. But if steps aren't taken, he said, the penalties would be severe.

"We're the piggy bank that everybody is robbing," Trump said. "And that ends."

Trump's pitch that world leaders eliminate all tariffs - or else - was his latest attempt to reorder the global trading system, which he says is stacked unfairly against the United States.

For example, on Friday evening, the White House issued a statement saying Trump and Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau were very close to a deal to rework the North American Free Trade Agreement.

But during his comments on Saturday morning, Trump said there were still a number of different ways the NAFTA talks could play out, including the possibility of doing separate deals with Mexico and Canada, effectively cleaving the 20-year agreement in two.

Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 09, 2018, 10:16:59 AM
Here's the reason that jobs in steel have declined in the USA:

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/the-u-s-steel-industry-a-reality-check/

Let's lift the sheets on their "expert" who penned this screed and see where her background came from:

Previously, de Rugy was a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, a policy analyst at the Cato Institute, and a research fellow at the Atlas Economic Research Foundation. Before moving to the United States, she oversaw academic programs in France for the Institute for Humane Studies Europe. She received her MA in economics from the Paris Dauphine University and her PhD in economics from the Pantheon-Sorbonne University.


Uh huh... :-\


Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Metron2267 on June 09, 2018, 11:48:11 AM
Let's lift the sheets on their "expert" who penned this screed and see where her background came from:

Previously, de Rugy was a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, a policy analyst at the Cato Institute, and a research fellow at the Atlas Economic Research Foundation. Before moving to the United States, she oversaw academic programs in France for the Institute for Humane Studies Europe. She received her MA in economics from the Paris Dauphine University and her PhD in economics from the Pantheon-Sorbonne University.


Uh huh... :-\


Your point? You think she's less qualified to state the facts of steel output and the economics within than Trump who has no academic or industrial qualifications in either?

Oh I see!!! It's because she attended French universities? Is the premise that she is less qualified because they're French?

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Metron2267 on June 09, 2018, 11:45:25 AM
Canuckistan will pay, trust me!

https://www.lmtonline.com/news/article/Trump-floats-end-to-all-tariffs-threatens-major-12981080.php

QUEBEC CITY - President Donald Trump told foreign leaders at the Group of Seven summit that they must dramatically reduce trade barriers with the United States or they would risk losing access to the world's largest economy, delivering his most defiant trade threat yet to his counterparts from around the globe.

Trump, in a news conference before leaving for Singapore, described private conversations he held over two days with the leaders of Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and Canada. He said he pushed them to consider removing every single tariff or trade barrier on American goods, and in return he would do the same. But if steps aren't taken, he said, the penalties would be severe.

Course they will..  ::)  He knows it's the consumer who will pay more doesn't he? Doesn't he?

Quote
"We're the piggy bank that everybody is robbing," Trump said. "And that ends."

Trump's pitch that world leaders eliminate all tariffs - or else - was his latest attempt to reorder the global trading system, which he says is stacked unfairly against the United States.

For example, on Friday evening, the White House issued a statement saying Trump and Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau were very close to a deal to rework the North American Free Trade Agreement.

But during his comments on Saturday morning, Trump said there were still a number of different ways the NAFTA talks could play out, including the possibility of doing separate deals with Mexico and Canada, effectively cleaving the 20-year agreement in two.


Trump said this, Trump said that, Trump raged this and that..blah blah... He is full of shit, and thinks his bullying tactics will work.. Well he's going to get one hell of a shock and only he and his cult followers believe anything he says.

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Metron2267 on June 09, 2018, 11:40:37 AM
Not only making it cheaper, and they have for at least the past ten years, but also dumping product from lower cost plants around the world:

What? Last ten years? You mean nothing to do with Trump then? Just as it said in the article I linked...Who knew?

Quote
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/china-steel-now-as-cheap-as-cabbage-weighing-on-global-price-2014-10-13

The average price for the range of steel products on offer has fallen to 3,212 yuan ($520) per metric ton for the first half of the year, down 28% from the average price in 2012, CISA data showed.

“Sharply slowing steel demand growth in an oversupplied sector is the key reason for China’s currently low steel prices,” CIMB analysts said in a recent note.

Standard & Poor’s also cited Chinese oversupply as the largest headache for steel makers in the rest of Asia, and is likely to remain so.

http://www.industryweek.com/environment/viewpoint-why-china-cheaper

Above all, there is the ever-present currency manipulation, where China undervalues their currency by an estimated 30%-40%, which simply makes every product that China ships out 30-40% cheaper than those of a potential American competitor.

Finally, China has a national strategy of what is called "dumping." "Dumping" is defined as the act of a manufacturer in one country exporting a product to another country at a price that is either below the price it charges in its home market or is below its cost of production. The goal of "dumping" is to capture the market or destroy the competition for a particular product or commodity so the price to the end user or consumer is lowered way below the competition, often below cost. "Dumping" is one of the strategies China uses as a neomercantilist country. Neomercantilism is a term used to describe a policy which encourages exports, discourages imports, controls capital movement and centralizes currency decisions in the hands of a central government.

So "not needed" that Europeon steel maker Arcellor-Mital has major steel operations in the US?

http://www.usa.arcelormittal.com

ArcelorMittal is one of the largest steelmakers in North America and serves a broad U.S. manufacturing base. In the United States, ArcelorMittal owns and operates 26 facilities, including mines, integrated steelmaking facilities, mini-mills and finishing operations.

In the U.S., we employ more than 18,000 people with industrial operations in 12 states and a presence in 14 states and the District of Columbia.

18000 people... Not hundreds of thousands as it used to be then? Like the article said...  ::)

Quote
ArcelorMittal USA is part of ArcelorMittal, the world’s largest steel and mining company. ArcelorMittal formed in 2006 when the world's largest steel company, Mittal Steel Company N.V., merged with the Arcelor S.A., the second largest. Today, ArcelorMittal has approximately 199,000 employees across 60 countries.

US Steel begs to differ:

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/07/us-steel-reopening-plant-and-bringing-back-jobs-ceo-on-trump-tariffs.html

US Steel CEO: We're reopening an idled plant and bringing back 500 jobs due to Trump tariffs
We're excited "to tell our employees in the community in Granite City, Illinois, that we will be calling back 500 employees," says CEO David Burritt.
Burritt says the facility had been idle since December 2015 because of what he called unfair trade practices.

You even lie about your own nation, unsurprising that!

I fucking lived there. I knew blokes who lost their jobs. Not just at British Steel, but the suppliers, and services that depended on it.

Quote
http://www.thecommentator.com/article/3509/the_truth_about_thatcher_and_the_steel_industry

And it wasn't long before Steel broke out the Big Lie: "in 1980 Margaret Thatcher’s government shut down most of the steel industry, as part of her plan to break the unions". You hear this argument a lot, as though repeating it will make it true. But a look at the facts shows that it isn’t.

In 1955 the British steel industry was working at 98 percent of capacity. But, over the following years, this declined as a result of its failure to adopt new methods (such as the basic oxygen steel-making process and continuous casting) and increased steel production in other countries. By 1966 just 79 percent of capacity was being utilised.

The following year a large chunk of the British steel industry was renationalised (it had been nationalised for a few years in the early 1950s). In 1970 the new British Steel had a record output of 23.8 million tonnes (4.7 percent of the world total, down from 25 percent in 1929).

But the industry was now being run for political rather than economic ends and massive over-manning and consequent low productivity became endemic. By 1977 output had actually fallen to 20 million tonnes (3 percent of the world total). By 1978 British Steel was operating at just two-thirds capacity. And by 1979, British steel workers were a third less productive than their French competitors and 40 percent less productive than West German steel workers.

In the fiscal year 1978-1979 British Steel lost £309 million. This rose to £545 million the following year, one in which workers struck for six weeks for a 20 percent pay rise. They got it, but my dad, who worked in a steel works in Sheffield at the time, said that by the time they went back to work their foreign customers had gone elsewhere.

In 1980-1981, British Steel lost a staggering £1 billion on turnover of £3 billion, earning itself a place in the Guinness Book of Records. By contrast the output of Britain's small private sector steel industry doubled between 1967 and 1979, from 3 million tonnes to 6 million tonnes.

Between 1967 and 1974 employment in the British steel industry fell from 250,000 to 197,000. And by 1990 it had fallen again by 74 percent to 51,000. But other developed countries also saw drastic declines in employment in their steel industries in the same period. In France, for example, employment fell by 70 percent, while in the United States it fell by 60 percent. Even Germany lost 46 percent of its steel workforce.

What happened to towns like Sheffield or Corby was not part of some Thatcherite vendetta and instead was part of a general trend across the industrialised world. It happened in the Rhur Valley and Ohio, was Maggie Thatcher responsible for that too?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/industry/engineering/11941457/Margaret-Thatcher-would-never-have-let-the-steel-industry-collapse.html

British Steel, as it was then, was competing with foreign companies, some that were nationalised and subsidised. If the Government had acted as if it were in a free market it would have had to let British Steel go under. Instead, it gave state aid to allow the firm to get back to fighting fitness.

I said she withdrew the subsidies to British Steel...Your point?

Quote
Garbage!

You do talk a lot of it I know...  :-\

Quote
China has been buying up steel plants globally to evade dumping restrictions:

http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/06/news/economy/us-steel-vietnam-china-tariffs/index.html

The U.S. is slapping heavy taxes on steel imports from Vietnam, saying China is using the country as a way to dodge earlier penalties.
Certain steel products Vietnam is selling to the U.S. are being produced from Chinese materials, the U.S. Department of Commerce said in a statement late Tuesday.
American steelmakers complained last year that Chinese companies appeared to be avoiding huge tariffs by diverting products to Vietnam for "minor processing" before they were shipped to the U.S.


Predictable leftard "shoot the messenger" action in lieu of factual rebuttal.


As opposed to 'fake news' from Trumptards?  ;D ;D


Quote
Short term yes...mid term maybe, long term no.

That's utterly illogical.

Anything that drives up their costs will of course hurt them.

WTF is wrong with your brain?

Short term!

So you can read his mind?

Some trick that...

Ya think?

A "bubble" called the high stakes global and domestic market property development and construction business ?

Of course he only considers "himself" when having to negotiate with multiple private and governmental entities, I mean that's logical reasoning, isn't it?

You apparently haven't a single neuron correlated with reality or the facts.

It's really mental of you.

:-\


No-one can read Trump's mind...by dint that it's fleeting and can't focus. Not helped by his attention span of a mayfly.


Yorkshire pud

Quote from: StarrMountain on June 09, 2018, 12:29:25 PM
https://youtu.be/6kcz-C2Et7o


Course he does..


From a manchild who wouldn't know how to tell the truth if his marriage and presidency depended on it... ;)


SredniVashtar

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 09, 2018, 11:53:35 AM

Your point? You think she's less qualified to state the facts of steel output and the economics within than Trump who has no academic or industrial qualifications in either?

Oh I see!!! It's because she attended French universities? Is the premise that she is less qualified because they're French?

And the Cato Institute isn't exactly left-leaning.

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: ACE of CLUBS on June 09, 2018, 10:48:38 AM
Trump has 'thrown the bone' to the American consumer .....
We will do well regardless .....
No big deal.

John Bolton (that well known basis for any number of muppets Frank Oz and Jim Henson could have used) backs Trump's idea that the tariffs are necessary for national security reasons... The countries include Canada, UK, Germany, South Korea, France, Norway, Spain, Italy, Denmark, Australia and several other countries who have and are currently engaged in assisting the US in national security matters in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Africa and other places they'd sooner not be in, but if they withdrew the consequences for all would be less than favourable..

Perhaps Theresa May should suggest that the USAF and Navy withdraw their squadrons and fleets from the airbases and sub bases used in the British Isles if the UK is such a security risk? It would only seem appropriate...And while they're at it, close Menwith Hill and Fylingdales to US military personnel. The other 'security risk' countries could follow suit and politely but firmly tell Trump that obviously US forces would be much safer and secure either back in the US or maybe none NATO countries.

Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 09, 2018, 11:53:35 AM

Your point? You think she's less qualified to state the facts of steel output and the economics within than Trump who has no academic or industrial qualifications in either?

Oh I see!!! It's because she attended French universities? Is the premise that she is less qualified because they're French?

Shoot the messenger isn't quite as amusing when I wing one of yours, now is it?

Tee hee! ;D

Also, she's so very wrong when she says:

"China was the 10th largest supplier of steel to the U.S. market in 2017 and 94 percent of China’s steel exports were actually subjected to special tariffs (so tariffs are not that great at changing the country’s behavior, I guess)."

When China buys up Vietnamese steel mills to dump product on us they are not being counted accurately.

https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/the-world-s-top-iron-and-steel-importers.html

Top Countries by Iron and Steel Imports
Standing at first place in this list is the United States, with its iron and steel imports in 2014 valued at an astounding $49 billion USD.

http://www.americanmanufacturing.org/blog/entry/american-steelmakers-say-china-is-dodging-tariffs-by-sending-steel-through

U.S. steelmakers say Chinese steel companies are purposely avoiding U.S. import tariffs by routing their shipments through Vietnam â€" and they want the Commerce Department to take action to stop it.

he Commerce Department repeatedly has found that China is dumping its steel into the U.S. market, and has issued several sets of anti-dumping and countervailing duties on steel imports from China. But these new cases move the issue into new territory.

And as the Wall Street Journal reported on Friday, the American steel companies appear to have a pretty strong case:

"Independent trade data appear to lend credence to the steelmaker claims. In the first six months of 2016, shipments of steel from Vietnam to the U.S. increased to 312,329 tons, from 25,756 tons. Over the same period, Chinese exports of steel to Vietnam rose 46% to 6.3 million tons from 4.3 million tons, according to data firm Global Trade Information Services."


And when China floods the market they depress prices.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/03/06/steel-imports-threaten-national-security-editorials-debates/32667473/

National security is only as strong as American steel: It depends on the domestic industry’s ability to manufacture steel from start to finish. A weaker or non-existent American steel industry leaves our nation dependent on countries focused on their economic interests and well-being, not ours. That leaves our country vulnerable, which is not a position the United States should ever be willing to accept.

America has the capacity to melt and pour the steel it needs for national defense; to build its infrastructure; to produce and transport energy and electricity; and to supply manufacturers of automobiles, machinery, appliances and other consumer and industrial goods, from tin cans to bulldozers.

For decades, foreign steel producers have targeted our open market with a flood of imports. While our domestic capability has remained stagnant since 2001, global excess steel capacity amounts to more than 700 million metric tons â€" more than six times the U.S. steel market. Unfair and illegal practices have left the U.S. steel industry too close to the brink. Tens of thousands of jobs have been lost, and thousands more are at risk.

This is why President Trump has committed to begin to level the playing field on steel imports: for the security and manufacturing strength of the United States.

While no one can predict tomorrow’s threats, the geopolitical climate will remain complex and uncertain. When we let foreign producers seize the lead in manufacturing for the sake of short-term wins, we risk surrendering America’s long-term future. President Trump’s strong action on steel imports recognizes that America cannot afford to outsource an industry as vital to security as steel.

David B. Burritt is the president and CEO of U. S. Steel.

Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 09, 2018, 11:56:51 AM
Trump said this, Trump said that, Trump raged this and that..blah blah... He is full of shit, and thinks his bullying tactics will work.. Well he's going to get one hell of a shock and only he and his cult followers believe anything he says.

Your irrational hatred of Trump and America itself are hardly worth commenting upon.

Go back to Blighty, you don't belong here. >:(

Metron2267

Quote from: Yorkshire pud on June 09, 2018, 12:08:24 PM
What? Last ten years? You mean nothing to do with Trump then? Just as it said in the article I linked...Who knew?

That timeline was relevant to China's overall recent move to control the global steel market, the only meaningful response is by Trump, as anyone who followed the Obamessiah can see.

Quote18000 people... Not hundreds of thousands as it used to be then? Like the article said...  ::)

Uh...the 18,000 cited are Arcelor-Mital employees, not the total employed in our steel industry.

Can you ever speak honestly or discuss data accurately?

QuoteI fucking lived there. I knew blokes who lost their jobs. Not just at British Steel, but the suppliers, and services that depended on it.

Anecdotal.

QuoteI said she withdrew the subsidies to British Steel...Your point?

Already made, read the citations again if you can't come to grips with them.

She saved your steel industry, you dog in the manger traitor.

QuoteYou do talk a lot of it I know...  :-\

As opposed to 'fake news' from Trumptards?  ;D ;D

Fake news is a dominant leftard activity.

QuoteNo-one can read Trump's mind...by dint that it's fleeting and can't focus. Not helped by his attention span of a mayfly.

And yet you represent your alleged ability to do so time and again, you raving hypocrite. >:(

Yorkshire pud

Quote from: Metron2267 on June 09, 2018, 02:30:39 PM
Your irrational hatred of Trump and America itself are hardly worth commenting upon.

Go back to Blighty, you don't belong here. >:(


Oh you poor deluded soul.. I don't hate America you fucking moron..I live in America, married to an American woman.. As for hating Trump, naaa, I despise him and all he represents (Himself and his cronies). If Obama or his current and former associates were under suspicion for a quarter of what Trump and his circus are (Manafort alone now has 25 indictments against him) you'd be wanting everyone with pitchforks outside the WH..Funny how Trumptards are so forgiving when it's Trump and the GOP who pretty much trash everything the Republican party used to say they stood for.

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